Is there a better forum of holding (actually surrendering) assets then an Irrevocable Trust....???
Anyone know "much" about "TRUSTS" If expecting DEPRESSION...??
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I would ask an attorney; probably an Elder Lawyer, one that specializes in trusts, and estate planning. We had a very good one recommended to us, and I was very impressed with how thorough they were. JMHO, but it is far to complicated a subject to get advice on line. Sit down with somebody, and discuss your situation.
I agree 100%. But sometimes you can pick-up little tidbits of information reference problems others have encountered. I actually know a lot about the short comings of this type trust.
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You may know more than myself. We are in the early stages of estate planning ourselves.
Sooner or later you should engage with a lawyer to do it right. Better sooner. There are time limits in that things must be set up for a specific time period ... in my case it is a year. I believe "being of sound mind and body" is required.
I have also heard that insurance policies can help alleviate tax issues with heirs. Figure out what the tax hit will be and get a policy that will cover the taxes. Insurance is tax free.
Please share what you learn because it can help us learn from what tou discover.
Ben
Get a lawyer first.
There so many laws in different states you just can't DIY.
My Mom put her place in a special needs trust for my brother. Her estate now goes to me and my 2 other brothers in equal shares. The state cannot touch it and that's why she did a trust.
The government will look back for a set number of years and if it's only been a short time since the trust was established they will claim it was just to avoid having them make a claim and they will give you a hard time.
I think in Washington they look back 3 years. No idea how long in Alaska.
There so many laws in different states you just can't DIY.
My Mom put her place in a special needs trust for my brother. Her estate now goes to me and my 2 other brothers in equal shares. The state cannot touch it and that's why she did a trust.
The government will look back for a set number of years and if it's only been a short time since the trust was established they will claim it was just to avoid having them make a claim and they will give you a hard time.
I think in Washington they look back 3 years. No idea how long in Alaska.
First, I think you should talk to a lawyer. That said, you might want to read up on the attached. It's not really the thing you are looking for, but its an option that many folks use. I would think most lawyers would bring up this trust first.
https://www.medicaidplanningassistance.org/miller-trusts/
https://www.medicaidplanningassistance.org/miller-trusts/
Since you mentioned "surrendering" assets, that indicates that you probably know the difference between a revocable and an irrevocable trust. An irrevocable trust will protect assets from future legal problems you may have, creditors, etc. whereas a revocable trust will not. But if your goal is to avoid probate and associated costs at your death then a revocable trust is fine for that. But it won't protect your assets. I should clarify, it can protect your assets, just not as well as an irrevocable trust. Once you put your assets in an irrevocable trust, you don't own them any more and can't get them back. Your designated beneficiary gets them. A revocable trust can be changed or terminated, an irrevocable trust cannot (not easily, at least).
But it sounds like you probably already know these differences. Generally trusts are set up by lawyers. Maybe in some states a lawyer is not required, I wouldn't know. But the "you can't change it later" nature of an irrevocable trust pretty much dictates that you want a competent lawyer to set it up, even if your state would allow you as an individual to do it.
Before you meet with your lawyer, have a solid idea of what you are trying to accomplish. Don't try to figure out yourself how to accomplish it, but be able to clearly state what you are trying to accomplish. Protection from creditors/legal problems? Keeping your money out of governments grubby little hands when you die? And think about the ramifications of remaining in control of your assets for your own use (revocable trust) or relinquishing control and giving them away, never for you to be able to use them again yourself (irrevocable trust).
Chances are, you are indeed needing a trust. Which kind, that is what you need to think about. However, I would let your lawyer tell you about all the options. There may be something better than a trust for your specific situation. I'm not a lawyer and wouldn't know.
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I think it depends on what you are wanting to do. What kind of assets do you want to surrender? If it's a piece of property with or without a home or buildings on it, you might want to look into a LadyBird Deed. That kind of deed keeps you as the owner until you die. At that point, whomever you designate as your beneficiary on the deed takes your death certificate to the courthouse and they take over ownership. No probate and no fuss.
Although, it is my understanding that this type of deed is not an option in all states. You'd want to meet with a lawyer that is familiar with the LadyBird deed if it's available to you since it is a specialized area of expertise. If there aren't family members waiting in the wings to fight for your stuff when you die, it's a pretty easy and inexpensive way to pass on your property to your designated family members without probate and without a trust. If you know people are going to come out of the woodwork to lay claim to your assets when you die, then perhaps a trust would make more sense. If there isn't going to be a lot of drama, a LadyBird Deed with a Will (to cover other assets that you may have forgotten about) would probably suffice.
Although, it is my understanding that this type of deed is not an option in all states. You'd want to meet with a lawyer that is familiar with the LadyBird deed if it's available to you since it is a specialized area of expertise. If there aren't family members waiting in the wings to fight for your stuff when you die, it's a pretty easy and inexpensive way to pass on your property to your designated family members without probate and without a trust. If you know people are going to come out of the woodwork to lay claim to your assets when you die, then perhaps a trust would make more sense. If there isn't going to be a lot of drama, a LadyBird Deed with a Will (to cover other assets that you may have forgotten about) would probably suffice.
Long-long ago I in partnership with my CPA taught a course for the "Tax Reduction Institute", Trenton, NJ. Part of the course involved this.
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I have an attorney in Los Anchorage that did my will, which includes a trust. That is what their firm specialises in. I am happy enough with her. They also do free estate planning seminars. PM me if you want her name and number.
A Ladybird Deed can keep your house out of probate. But if you have other assets that exceed certain limits, you'll have to go through probate anyway, for that other stuff. That "certain limit" varies by state. Here in Colorado, it's something quite small. Like $50k or so. A revocable trust that owns your house is somewhat like a LadyBird Deed in functionality, except a trust can own other stuff besides just your house. I think a LadyBird Deed can only hold land and structures on that land - but I'm not entirely sure about that. So if you don't own any significant assets besides land and structures, a LadyBird deed may be the ticket. But most of us here, being closer to "old" rather than "young", probably own a heck of a lot more assets (beyond our house) to be able to stay below the really small $50k (or whatever) limit. Just the unwanted junk in my basement probably exceeds that.
But talk to a lawyer in your state. Every state is different. And some things will force you into probate even if they aren't high value. Like owning land in a different state (which may or may no affect you, but it affected me living in Colorado and owning land in Texas).
But talk to a lawyer in your state. Every state is different. And some things will force you into probate even if they aren't high value. Like owning land in a different state (which may or may no affect you, but it affected me living in Colorado and owning land in Texas).
I have it. THANKS.
If you own stuff free and clear, and at some later time fall on hard times (as in a depression), then your future creditors can come after the stuff you already own to pay them back for what you owe them. However, if the stuff you own free and clear is put into an irrevocable trust, they cannot come after it. The down side is that after you put your stuff in an irrevocable trust, you no longer own it anymore. So for YOU, the irrevocable trust doesn't offer much benefit. However, for your BENEFICIARIES, that irrevocable trust protects your (previously owned) stuff.
My only experience with trusts is that when we bought our house the closing was delayed almost a month because the prior owners had done a DIY trust for it with their children. Don't DIY a trust, use a lawyer 
I know what the trust does.
I think the value of a real estate trust in a depression would drop like a rock.
That real estate would still have many expenses, or at least upkeep.
Real estate trust still have to pay taxes.
Maybe at the end of a depression it will still have a little value if the taxes are paid.
Who knows.
Just for entertainment......Study the distinctions between Judicial Foreclosure and Non-judicial foreclosure, and "deficiency Judgement". Cost me slightly over $963,000.00 for my education about that.
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If nobody but your beneficiaries are getting the real estate, all of your stuff if paid for, and there is no family drama, there would be no need for probate. One of the main advantages of the LBD is to avoid proate without having a trust. It is my understanding that your stuff is included with the property. Of coarse, I'm sure it may be different from state to state so I would find a lawyer within your state of residence and just ask them about the pros and cons of it in your area and in your situation.
Accounts have a beneficiary (and secondary) listed on them when they are set up. If circumstances have changed since those accounts were set up, then you will want to change that with the company you have an account with, which includes bank accounts, retirement accounts, life insurance, etc. Otherwise that beneficiary will get that account no matter what the other paperwork says. The beneficiary listied will get the cash......I've seen it happen with X's that walked away very happy b/c their dead X-spouse neglected to change their beneficiary on their accounts before they died, thinking that their will covered it all. It was sad to see the current spouse get nothing of those accounts during an already stressful time.
A LadyBird Deed is probably a whole lot cheaper than a trust. Our main trust cost us several thousand dollars. However, we have a lot more components included in that effort than just keeping things out of probate. Trusts can do a lot of things for you. The more you have them do, the more they cost. It would be nice if lawyers worked for free, but I wouldn't work for free either, so I can't blame them.
An additional note for anybody here considering a trust ... you will pay a lawyer to set one up (or you should, IMHO). But then you will have to transfer your assets to that trust. That is for you to do, not the lawyer. So you will have to cancel current bank accounts and set up new trust-owned bank accounts. You will have to transfer the deed to your house to the trust. Same with car deeds. Language will be written into the trust stating that "other things you own or will buy" are owned by the trust, so you don't have to specifically move your living room couch to the trust, for example. But bottom line, you don't just pay a lawyer to create the trust and then walk away with no ToDo's on your personal list. There is stuff that you will have to do after the lawyer creates the trust. This is called "funding the trust".
p.s. - "A bank account owned by a trust" seems to strike fear in average bankers hearts around here. We had to go through a bit of rigamarole the get in contact with the banks trust specialist.
p.s. - "A bank account owned by a trust" seems to strike fear in average bankers hearts around here. We had to go through a bit of rigamarole the get in contact with the banks trust specialist.
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Another note: While you're talking to your lawyer about trusts, ask about creating LLC's to own your home and any rental properties you may have. That is something you'll want to do as well. LLC's are simple, you can do those yourself. Then move the LLC's to the trust. I believe the LLC's are free (or super low cost) - but I don't know for sure because my wife did the LLC part. I think they can be done all online as well. Possibly things could vary by state however.
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I have had several LLC's for different businesses. I had this property I am selling in a LLC until I was out of all my businesses, and by moving it to my name I "then" did not have to pay property tax on the first $300,000.00 of assessed value.
The reason we use LLC's is for our rental properties. Each house (or business in one case) and the land it's on are owned by a separate LLC. So, say, if someone decides to break in, gets stuck in the chimney as they attempt to breach, and decides to sue for their pain and suffering - they can only sue the owner. Which is the LLC. Which owns nothing more than that specific house and land it's on. So they can't get at any of our other assets - like our personal house, other rental properties, our bank accounts, etc. Ditto for a renter who burns their hand on the stove and sues us because we didn't post a sign "Warning! Stove might be hot if you turn it on!"
You go to an investment advisor to learn how to make more money, you go to a lawyer to learn how to protect what you already have. Both pieces are necessary for financial security. If you ignore the "protect what you have" piece, then all your carefully chosen investments may become the investments of the fool that stepped on your sidewalk and tripped themselves before suing you (figuratively speaking). That's part of why our main house is owned by an LLC too, not just our rental properties.
You go to an investment advisor to learn how to make more money, you go to a lawyer to learn how to protect what you already have. Both pieces are necessary for financial security. If you ignore the "protect what you have" piece, then all your carefully chosen investments may become the investments of the fool that stepped on your sidewalk and tripped themselves before suing you (figuratively speaking). That's part of why our main house is owned by an LLC too, not just our rental properties.
