Goats

[QuietH3art]

I searched through and didn't find a thread for goats. Since I've been doing a lot of research and just got mine today, I decided it was time for this thread so I can share.

From all of my research, I'd decided on Nigerian Dwarf goats because their milk has the highest fat content, which means the cream is more likely to separate to the top of the container when left to sit in the fridge for a couple of days. However, a very kind lady let me nearly steal 3 of her Myotonic goats today after I'd discovered how expensive small goats are. Nigerian Dwarf does can sell for as much as 300-400 apiece. Myotonics are the same, however, she took pity on me and sold me 3 for the price of 1 and one of them is pregnant, another is in milk now and the 3rd is a 6 month old buckling.

Below is a picture of me attempting to milk a goat for the first time. My son was definitely at the wrong angle. Right now, it's rather a wrestling match and I'm letting the milk go on the ground. Tomorrow I am building a milking stand for her so she can't jump away from me.

There are 5 main reasons that goat's milk is better for humans than cow's milk. 1. the protein allergin in goat's milk is 89% less than that in cow's milk, 2. Goat's milk is naturally homogenized. Basically this means that the fat globules are really, really tiny and there's a lot of technical jargon but these tiny fat globules means they aren't lighter than milk so they don't separate whereas cow's milk fat globules are really big and have to be pushed through a really tiny hole in the homogenization process, which breaks them up and releases a superoxide, otherwise known as free radicals. 3. Goat's milk is easier to digest - this is also about the tiny fat globules, as is 4. goat's milk rarely causes lactose intolerance. And 5. Goat's milk matches up to the human body more closely than cow's milk, both biochemically and thermodynamically.

And all of that turned out to be just bonus for me. I wanted a goat because I am just one person who enjoys a cup of milk a day, some butter on my bread and cheese on my salad and crackers. I didn't need the gallons of milk a day that a cow would give me.

And last, but not least, everything I have read has said that goats don't eat grass. The picture below puts the lie to that. These Myotonics are loving my grass (and my willow tree but that's okay). The Myotonics, because of their genetic condition of stiffening muscles when they panic, are not climbers and are easily contained by a fence.

For those who do like to eat meat, the Myotonics are also kept primarily for meat. They tend to be more heavily muscled than other small goat breeds because of their myotonia.

And for the weavers, in the winter, a good Myotonic provides cashmere. The buckling I got is already showing signs of developing a very nice coat.

They also make very nice pets as they are small, docile and very social.

So I'll keep you posted on my adventures as a goat-keeper and if anyone has questions, I'll do my best to find the answers because I'll probably need the answer myself. And if anyone has any experience with this type of goat, I'd love to hear from you.

Yes, I'm way too excited about this.

 

[QuietH3art]

I did it! Calm, confident, determined. I talked quietly to her while holding her still and she gave me about a half a cup of milk!

 

[QuietH3art]

Today I am building a goat-milking stand. I found a simple plan and it shouldn't take me more than about an hour to do it. I'll post a picture of the finished stand, but here are the plans in case anyone else wants them: http://fiascofarm.com/files/Milk_Stand_Plans.pdf

 

[Roninsensei]

 

[Silent Bob]

Today I am building a goat-milking stand. I found a simple plan and it shouldn't take me more than about an hour to do it. I'll post a picture of the finished stand, but here are the plans in case anyone else wants them: http://fiascofarm.com/files/Milk_Stand_Plans.pdf

Hey LW,

You might want to shoot off a PM to Danil54grl,

Last time we PM'd she was pretty busy with her farm, but I know she has had lots of experience with goats. Might save you some time if you chatted with her. She is a wealth of experience and would be my go to person if I had questions about goats.

Hope this helps.

 

[QuietH3art]

Miss Diana and I have come to an arrangement with the milking this morning. She was very cooperative and gave me half a pint. Myotonics are not huge milk producers and her udders and teats are very different from the goat in the video Ronensensai provided. Due to the fact that her kid was just taken from her yesterday, I'm going to continue to milk her 3 times a day for the next couple of days, then back down to twice a day. My understanding is that when they are actively nursing their kid, you have to separate the kid from mama at night (after they reach 2 weeks of age), then milk the mama first thing in the morning only.
I was also very pleased to notice that the milk I got last night actually had a fine layer of cream on it this morning which is something I did not expect after all of my research. It's difficult to not drink it right up because it does have a wonderful taste, but I am going to label each of my jars of milk by the day they are produced and let them sit in the refrigerator a couple of days to see if I can just skim off enough cream to make butter by next weekend.
All in all, I am tickled pink with my new goats. I've just gathered the wood I'll need to build a milking stand which I have decided will go in the corner of my shed because I have no other good source of shade at the moment and milking in the sun is no fun for me or Diana.

 

[Brent S]

Miss Diana and I have come to an arrangement with the milking this morning. She was very cooperative and gave me half a pint. Myotonics are not huge milk producers and her udders and teats are very different from the goat in the video Ronensensai provided. Due to the fact that her kid was just taken from her yesterday, I'm going to continue to milk her 3 times a day for the next couple of days, then back down to twice a day. My understanding is that when they are actively nursing their kid, you have to separate the kid from mama at night (after they reach 2 weeks of age), then milk the mama first thing in the morning only.
I was also very pleased to notice that the milk I got last night actually had a fine layer of cream on it this morning which is something I did not expect after all of my research. It's difficult to not drink it right up because it does have a wonderful taste, but I am going to label each of my jars of milk by the day they are produced and let them sit in the refrigerator a couple of days to see if I can just skim off enough cream to make butter by next weekend.
All in all, I am tickled pink with my new goats. I've just gathered the wood I'll need to build a milking stand which I have decided will go in the corner of my shed because I have no other good source of shade at the moment and milking in the sun is no fun for me or Diana.

Are the myotonic's the same as a faint goat? My son would be constantly scaring them for fun! I'm so happy for you, it's motivating me to finish all the fencing I have to do. I put up about 30' this weekend, but that's not even a scratch of all that needs to be done. All in due time! I have to admit, your animals look fat and healthy I've looked at some goats locally that were scrawny and I'll kept.

 

[QuietH3art]

They are often called the Tennessee Fainting Goat or the Texas Stiff-Legged Goat. They are actually the only breed natural to the US although they aren't really a separate breed but rather a combination of a number of breeds - But they don't actually faint. They have myotonia congenita, which has to do with the muscles stiffening when they panic, it is not neurological or involving the brain. That is the main reason they are raised as a meat goat. That constant stiffening puts more muscle on them. They do adapt pretty quickly to new things though and the adults are pretty good at staying upright when they stiffen. Another advantage to them is that because of their problem they are not jumpers or climbers and tend to be very docile. The lady I got them from has a herd of about 20 left and they all have names and wear collars - they are her pets. Keep in mind also that the white one is pregnant, but with all the "grass" they've been eating here in the last 24 hours, they all 3 look pregnant! Oh wait, and there's another advantage to them - this breed in particular is parasite resistant and it also has to do with the myotonia congenita. Yes, I've been reading like crazy about them in the last day and a half. On the negative side, they seem to only produce about 1/2 pint of milk per milking - does with kids can only be milked once a day, after weaning, twice a day.
I, too, am an animal lover and these goats and any offspring they have will be my pets first. I've already started giving Diana a treat both before and after milking her and thanking her for her milk. I think given where I live that I will be limited to 3 does so hopefully Dixie is carrying a doeling, otherwise I will have to purchase an unrelated doe elsewhere later down the road.

 

[Brent S]

They are often called the Tennessee Fainting Goat or the Texas Stiff-Legged Goat. They are actually the only breed natural to the US although they aren't really a separate breed but rather a combination of a number of breeds - But they don't actually faint. They have myotonia congenita, which has to do with the muscles stiffening when they panic, it is not neurological or involving the brain. That is the main reason they are raised as a meat goat. That constant stiffening puts more muscle on them. They do adapt pretty quickly to new things though and the adults are pretty good at staying upright when they stiffen. Another advantage to them is that because of their problem they are not jumpers or climbers and tend to be very docile. The lady I got them from has a herd of about 20 left and they all have names and wear collars - they are her pets. Keep in mind also that the white one is pregnant, but with all the "grass" they've been eating here in the last 24 hours, they all 3 look pregnant! Oh wait, and there's another advantage to them - this breed in particular is parasite resistant and it also has to do with the myotonia congenita. Yes, I've been reading like crazy about them in the last day and a half. On the negative side, they seem to only produce about 1/2 pint of milk per milking - does with kids can only be milked once a day, after weaning, twice a day.
I, too, am an animal lover and these goats and any offspring they have will be my pets first. I've already started giving Diana a treat both before and after milking her and thanking her for her milk. I think given where I live that I will be limited to 3 does so hopefully Dixie is carrying a doeling, otherwise I will have to purchase an unrelated doe elsewhere later down the road.

There are some really videos on u tube about people scaring them, poor little buggars! I hadn't seen any of them in my area for sale but will look harder when I get ready. You've got me motivated now.

 

[QuietH3art]

It apparently doesn't even take scaring them for their muscles to stiffen sometimes. I've noticed when mine come running to me in the morning that Diana and Denver will pause for a minute with their back legs stretched out, then kind of continue hopping towards me. Dixie actually has not had a single stiffening episode, so she may just be a carrier. It is a recessive gene.
My daughter had Myotonics for a long time. One day, not even thinking about it, she went out to feed wearing cammo. The goats never saw her coming. She said she wished she'd had her camera for that one because every single goat just fell over like there'd been an explosion.

 

[QuietH3art]

Another wonderful benefit of the Myotonic goat - the males don't seem to develop that characteristic billy goat odor that can sour or bitter the milk. Diana had been kept in with the herd, which included several mature bucks, until I brought her home with me. If I gave you a cup of her milk to drink you would think it was store-bought whole cow's milk with maybe just a tiny pinch of sweetener added. And Denver definitely knows he's a billy at 6 1/2 months and he doesn't smell any different from Dixie and Diana.
Brent, if you're ready for goats by the time we arrange a meet and greet for the southeast, maybe I could bring you a couple from the lady I got mine from. Or, my son could bring some by for you the next time he goes to visit his girlfriend in Alabama, if he doesn't end up moving down there as he'd originally planned.

 

[Gazrok]

Never really thought about it, but wow, milk, cheese, wool, meat...pretty damn useful animal to have around.
I guess the big factor would be how much do they cost to keep in feed, etc. each month? I mean, I know they eat just about anything, but still.....

 

[QuietH3art]

Never really thought about it, but wow, milk, cheese, wool, meat...pretty damn useful animal to have around.
I guess the big factor would be how much do they cost to keep in feed, etc. each month? I mean, I know they eat just about anything, but still.....

Let's go even further with what goats produce - milk-whole or skimmed, butter (and that also produces whey which you can feed to your other livestock), cheese, yogurt - not just wool, but cashmere at 1/3 lb per goat per year (not a huge benefit but still something if you have enough of them) and, of course, meat. Oh wait, they also make excellent pets and I discovered yesterday, they are also a sort of alarm system. Every time someone walked down the road in front of my house, the goats "talked" to them quite loudly. The really don't require a lot of space. My 3 are in a 60x100 space. And no food supplement is necessary if there's grass, weeds, briars and low-hanging trees. They will eat hay but the breeder told me if you give them hay and goat food, they won't forage. They also take easily to a collar and cable attached to a cinderblock or stake so you can move them around as you need things eaten down. And, it seems no matter what they eat, their meat and milk maintains the same taste and nutritional quality. So it looks like the only real expense to them is buying them.

 

[Gazrok]

Wow. I will really have to consider them then. Thanks! A lot of my neighbors do have them, now I think I know why.

 

[Brent S]

Let's go even further with what goats produce - milk-whole or skimmed, butter (and that also produces whey which you can feed to your other livestock), cheese, yogurt - not just wool, but cashmere at 1/3 lb per goat per year (not a huge benefit but still something if you have enough of them) and, of course, meat. Oh wait, they also make excellent pets and I discovered yesterday, they are also a sort of alarm system. Every time someone walked down the road in front of my house, the goats "talked" to them quite loudly. The really don't require a lot of space. My 3 are in a 60x100 space. And no food supplement is necessary if there's grass, weeds, briars and low-hanging trees. They will eat hay but the breeder told me if you give them hay and goat food, they won't forage. They also take easily to a collar and cable attached to a cinderblock or stake so you can move them around as you need things eaten down. And, it seems no matter what they eat, their meat and milk maintains the same taste and nutritional quality. So it looks like the only real expense to them is buying them.

I think I've found a great career for you, goat salesman extradanare! After reading your posts I really want to get some! Just the fact that they will help clear briars and weeds is almost enough for me.

 

[QuietH3art]

Here's another plus with the Myotonic goats. A 3 foot fence will keep them confined, keep them out of your garden. My girls have put their front feet up on the trunk of my willow trees to get to higher branches, but they do not jump and won't climb on anything that isn't as sturdy as, say, a tree trunk.
And, no matter what they eat, they maintain the nutritional value and flavor of their milk. I set 2 glasses of milk out for my son. One was whole milk from the grocery store, the other was from my goat. He couldn't tell the difference. So you can also give them table scraps - some they will eat, some they won't. Mine loved the chopped up ends of the squash that I had for dinner tonight. They wouldn't eat the leftover watermelon and cantaloupe from the store, though. They love old bread. What they won't eat, I throw to the chickens.

 

[Brent S]

Here's another plus with the Myotonic goats. A 3 foot fence will keep them confined, keep them out of your garden. My girls have put their front feet up on the trunk of my willow trees to get to higher branches, but they do not jump and won't climb on anything that isn't as sturdy as, say, a tree trunk.
And, no matter what they eat, they maintain the nutritional value and flavor of their milk. I set 2 glasses of milk out for my son. One was whole milk from the grocery store, the other was from my goat. He couldn't tell the difference. So you can also give them table scraps - some they will eat, some they won't. Mine loved the chopped up ends of the squash that I had for dinner tonight. They wouldn't eat the leftover watermelon and cantaloupe from the store, though. They love old bread. What they won't eat, I throw to the chickens.

Glad to hear about the no climbing the fence thing. I don't want to think of all the work a goat could undo in a matter of hours with all my plants. I am excited to finish the fencing now. My problem is having too many projects! I need a clone to help out. There's a nice old man that comes in at my work. He has a full time man that fixes, builds, or repairs any project he wants. He's a retired engineer and just directs the guy on how and what he wants done. I'm still having fun with just affording the materials, forget the labor! Hope you have a great day, Brent.

 

[QuietH3art]

Glad to hear about the no climbing the fence thing. I don't want to think of all the work a goat could undo in a matter of hours with all my plants. I am excited to finish the fencing now. My problem is having too many projects! I need a clone to help out. There's a nice old man that comes in at my work. He has a full time man that fixes, builds, or repairs any project he wants. He's a retired engineer and just directs the guy on how and what he wants done. I'm still having fun with just affording the materials, forget the labor! Hope you have a great day, Brent.

You have some major bartering skills and items (wine), Brent. Yesterday, I traded a gallon of gas so my neighbor wouldn't have to run down the road for more when he needed to test start the 4 wheeler he's been working on. He had a submersible pump and took it over to my daughter's so she could borrow it to pump out her swimming pool. She brought me a big tub of butter from Wal-Mart for doing that.
Maybe you could trade something for someone's fence-building skills and time.

 

[Brent S]

You have some major bartering skills and items (wine), Brent. Yesterday, I traded a gallon of gas so my neighbor wouldn't have to run down the road for more when he needed to test start the 4 wheeler he's been working on. He had a submersible pump and took it over to my daughter's so she could borrow it to pump out her swimming pool. She brought me a big tub of butter from Wal-Mart for doing that.
Maybe you could trade something for someone's fence-building skills and time.

I just had one of my customers at work that is a prepper as well tell me about a barter group he is in. We didn't get into many details, but he said people trade labor, skills and things. He is supposed to email me info and call later on. It sounds like a pretty cool idea, and as I learn more I'll post about it. I think the world would be a lot better off if we all helped each other a little.

 

[QuietH3art]

I just had one of my customers at work that is a prepper as well tell me about a barter group he is in. We didn't get into many details, but he said people trade labor, skills and things. He is supposed to email me info and call later on. It sounds like a pretty cool idea, and as I learn more I'll post about it. I think the world would be a lot better off if we all helped each other a little.

It's the way things used to work. Someone might trade a basket of eggs and some milk to the doctor for a checkup. The doctor was too busy doctoring to grow his own food.
Bottom line is that if you have something someone else wants or needs or someone else has something you want or need, the exchange doesn't always have to be in cash and often cash isn't the most accurate medium of exchange these days anyway.
I hope you have good luck finding what you need through the barter group.

 

[QuietH3art]

At the end of my first week of owning goats, I have learned a lot. One Myotonic gives plenty of milk for one person at just about a pint a day. It takes me only about 10-15 minutes to milk Diana and we have a wonderful schedule going on now that I've started giving her goat sweet feed during milking. She really looks forward to that morning and evening. Unfortunately, it looks like it will take about 2 weeks worth of milk to gather enough cream to make butter. It takes about 4 days worth of milk to make 8 ounces of mozzarella cheese, which I intend to make tomorrow after I skim the cream off the top of the fourth pint I got this week. I am really looking forward to Dixie having her kid(s) so I'll have more milk each day.
I've researched pasteurization vs raw and have decided to stick with raw while maintaining strict hygienic practices during milking. A lot of the nutritional value is lost in pasteurization. However, if you have infant, elderly or immune comprised people in the household, you are better to pasteurize for them.
For those of you who want more milk for less work, I do recommend that you get dairy goats. Saanens and Nubians are excellent and produce about a gallon of milk per day. They are also easier to milk, with their udders and teats more like a cow's. The Myotonics really require a small hand and a careful technique which involves rolling the entire udder in your hand to bring the milk down. Perhaps I'll do a video of it one day. Diana and I are still learning though and I couldn't have asked for a more patient and understanding goat to learn from.

 

[Gazrok]

I just had one of my customers at work that is a prepper as well tell me about a barter group he is in. We didn't get into many details, but he said people trade labor, skills and things

Don't need to wait until SHTF either. Rural folks do bartering all the time....even sometimes with corporate America. I once traded advertising space to Lowes in exchange for a discount. Another time, I traded a saddle for advertising space in a national trade magazine. I've traded the use of a trailer for some bales of hay, and the use of a truck for tools, etc.

 

[QuietH3art]

So, I think unless you're in a position to have a lot of dairy goats, goats milk is just for drinking. I've skimmed the cream from almost a week's worth of goat's milk (7 pints) and this is how much butter I got from it:

 

[jontte]

but you know that you can make butter!! an other thing learned

 

[Gazrok]

If there is no other source though, post SHTF...at least you'd have it.

 

[QuietH3art]

Fortunately, butter is not an essential nutrient. We can drink the milk without removing the cream and still receive the same nutrients. I do have 2 gallons of milk now - one skim and one whole - the skim is frozen in half gallon containers while we drink the more recent whole milk.

 

[Marv.Schmitz87]

That's too cool! Thanks for sharing your experience. Im gonna add goats to my list of things I need to get into. Right in between bee keeping and bow hunting.

 

[jontte]

oooh,you lucky ones that can have animals....need to get a new job away from town

 

[Gazrok]

Sometimes, so many animals gets a bit insane. We have a menagerie here...6 cats, 6 dogs, 2 birds, 3 horses, 3 rabbits, 8 chickens. One of those birds is a Maluccan (sp?) Cockatoo, loudest bird on the frickin' planet. If she's squawking while the dogs are barking, it's enough to drive you mad, hehe.

Usually, it's just when we come home though, until we get them to settle down.

 

[jontte]

the bird is expessing its joy