Scenario #3 - Sunday April 22nd

[Sentry18]

It is 2:31am and you and your family/wife are all sound asleep. You hear a ruckus outside or perhaps your dog alerts to something. You immediately get up and check to see what is going on. If you are rural you see the lights of at least 2-3 vehicles stopped down the road from your residence. If you are urban you see 2-3 vehicles parked outside of your home part way between your house and your next door neighbors. In either case several people wearing similar clothing are standing together outside of the vehicles looking at what appears to be a map or a blue print on the hood of one of the vehicles using a very small colored flashlight. You do not see any patches or badges or anything that would indicate an occupation or organization. A couple people from the group look in the direction of your residence more than once.

- What is your first move?
- Do you notify the authorities or not?
- Do you turn the lights on or keep them off?
- Do you try to engage the group verbally?
- What next?

 

[TMT Tactical]

Well since it is only 2:31 a.m., I am still up an armed with my EDC. So first move is to get the shotgun and AR 15. Second move is to alert wife, who is sleeping. Third is to check cell phone and if working, call 911. Fourth items, lights stay off enough night lights type fixtures to illuminate any intruders. Fifth, I do not engage group verbally, I do place a few trip hazards in front of all 3 entry points. Last I wait for the sound of a forced entry.Upon forced entry, wife will use shotgun to target legs (she does not wan to kill) of invaders. I will use the AR 15 to target all the invaders (I am not concern about the health and welfare of intruders), standing or otherwise. If the group is law enforcement, I sure do hope they identity, prior to breaking down my door and entering. If Not LEO, I sure hope the coroner has a lot of space available, I don't take prisoners. Too much paperwork.

 

[havasu]

Damn, this one scares me. You want to assume it is law enforcement but the dead giveaway is the fact that no real cops would park in view of the suspects with their face down into a map. I'd place my family as far back from the front door as possible, rack my AR-15 that I really don't have because my California politicians think they are scary, and wait with the barrel pointed at the front door.

In California, there are currently a group of bad guys who are using this exact tactic to enter houses. They door kick the front door, yell "police", get everyone down on the ground, zip tie their hands together, then ransack the interior. Since neighbors believe it is just a tactical unit for the PD, the neighbors laugh at the bad luck of the neighbors and nobody calls the cops.

 

[dademoss]

1: Call 911
2: Get the AR (actually, at 2:30 AM, it's gonna be a Mini-14, I still have to be awake and thinking to run an AR
3: Wait for the police unless all hell breaks loose, directed at me or mine.

 

[OBG 57]

I'd just put on my earmuffs and sunglasses and wait patiently,safety off.

 

[hiwall]

They would have to be shooting short barreled rifles next to my window to wake me up.
The closest deputy is likely 45 miles away. I will be on my own.
Will likely shoot all but one so I have someone to dig the mass grave.

 

[TMT Tactical]

They would have to be shooting short barreled rifles next to my window to wake me up.
The closest deputy is likely 45 miles away. I will be on my own.
Will likely shoot all but one so I have someone to dig the mass grave.

I will use their vehicle to drag they away, out into the boonies. The wild pigs, buzzards and coyotes got to eat too. Waste not, want not, recycle.

 

[Bacpacker]

2:31, dead asleep.
Jump up, grab pistol, table beside bed, grab rifle and pray it is legit.
Be ready to light up anyone breaking in the door.
At this point don't matter if it's legit or not. Things have seriously gone downhill.

 

[Terri9630]

Its just me and the youngest this weekend. At anytime of day where I'm at a group on foot is definitely a problem. In this area its either gangs or cartel, though the cartel usually stays south. We don't have a swat team and the Sheriffs dpt and Police dpt know us and wouldn't dare try to make an entry like that.
First is a call to 911 and move the kid to my room where we have many bedside guns available and await back up. Lights stay off and no contact.

 

[Caribou]

Someone down the street looking at a map is not going to get me excited but it might get me into orange.
First, I'd put on my pants. Then I'd fill the holster on said pants. I'd probably put on my hearing aids as they have custom ear molds and make great ear plugs. Then I'd just watch, with the lights off. Turning a light on might invite a stranger to come ask directions and at that time of the day I don't need any visitors.

If they started for my home or a neighbors home I'd grab the shotgun.

 

[Sentry18]

I sleep in shorts and a t-shirt with a pair of slide on shoes right next to the bed. A few feet away is my pistol AR-15 without mounted strobing LED light and a sling bag marked "police" that contains a few spare mags, a flashlight, ASP baton, hearing protection, flash bang, and some tac-med supplies. I also have a short barreled shotgun handy with it's own sling bag full of goodies.

If I had the time or did not feel an immediate threat, I would call 911 and ask if something was going on in my neighborhood and likely request a few units. If not I would observe and if I felt an elevated sense of risk I would move my family to the lower level of my home (man cave / safe room). From there or any smart phone or tablet we can observe the video surveillance. Our home security system has 3 pendents and 3 mounted control panels, any of them can initiate a panic alarm which both calls 911 reporting our address and also activates 2 blue strobe lights and 2 external sirens, one set mounted in front of our house and one in back, both concealed by design. The internal sirens would also sound but they are far less of a deterrent than the external ones.

If the group was still dead set on entering my home they would face a challenge as my security by environmental design and physical barriers are well above average, but surely not unbeatable if you have enough time and resources. I would also take this to mean that they were purpose driven with evil intent and I would fall back to a position of tactical advantage, a sort of fatal funnel at the base of the staircase. I am confident I could hold off any small group who wanted to descend those stairs. But if I were to fall or be overwhelmed, the door to the man cave is concealed and not easily found in the dark. The rooms is reinforced and well insulted for sound. The three Rotties would also be unwelcoming and hopefully I could get 1 or 2 of them into the basement, but not necessarily into the man cave. When they go into protective mode they remain obedient but they also become more instinctive. The family would at that point be well armed as well (or at least my wife and oldest would be) most likely from my small rack of shotguns loaded with No. 4 buckshot.

After that it is all up the presumed bad guys and the possibly responding LEO's.

 

[havasu]

^ Call me Bond, James Bond!

 

[Peanut]

I’m a 25-minute drive from the county sheriff’s department. When I adopted retired working dogs on a regular basis the county’s k-9 officer would stop by occasionally. I haven’t seen him in 3 years. The undersheriff stopped and bought peaches once but I think that was 4 years ago.

The only sheriff’s department vehicle I’ve seen in 3 years is when a drunk lady rolled her car up against my pasture fence one night, the horses alerted me to the situation. I’m on my own, so are my plans...

 

[Woody]

Interesting scenario.



First thought would be that no LE agency would be stopped very close to a target and spend time with a map on the hood. They most likely have done their homework and know exactly which dwelling they are targeting. No group of ‘bad guys’ would do that either. Any group dressed all the same would mean, to me anyway, that they have the same objective. Objective does not necessarily mean ill intent, but they are there for the same reason only. Using a small colored light means they just do not want to kill their night vision. Same thing we did surf fishing. If they are looking for a specific landmark, they would need night vision or they would need a large spotlight flooding the neighborhood with light. It is 3:am and I would think a utility crew would have some courtesy until they find their project.



If it is a group doing emergency maintenance, I would think that they would not want to come storming into the wrong neighborhood, waking everyone up. I would be aware of no flashing yellow lights though and take note of it. It would raise a flag. Even on a routine inspection, they have the lights on.



I would raise the 911 flag to at least get someone notified that something very unusual was occurring and get LE on the way. I would not signal in any way that I was aware of their presence… for now. I would use cover of dark to just observe their actions.



A group that has three vehicles is going to overpower me, I have no firearms in this place. If they did start WALKING to my residence I would wait for a knock, then ask what the heck they wanted. If they started RUNNING towards my home, I would shelter in the basement, behind a random pile of stuff.

 

[Sourdough]

This is slightly close to my worse fear. I say slightly because it only slightly gets close to my nightmare event. First there is no LE within an hour and a half, and two hours is far more realistic, and eight hours is not beyond comprehension. No real value in calling 911 other then to somewhat cover my arse for what ever happens.

From where I am, I will not see any vehicles. There will be no warning.......zero. There will simply be humans suddenly in my environment, where there should be none. And how they are dressed is a non-issue, the issue is they are there.

My challenge will be to ultra high speed figure out "WHY". Sadly the truth is that I would loose any event, if the event was aggressive.

 

[Rick]

This is my nightmare scenario..
Because what IF its SWAT team???

If I light 'em up even if I "win", I will still got jail.
If its some MS13 kidnap/kill team and I dont resist I get to spend the next couple days getting tortured to death.

This is what our current SWAT culture has brought us to.
People now have to consider that a middle of the night break in might be police and dont resist and the risks involved are huge either way...

Neither a SWAT team nor a gang team are likely to act that way... but a call to 911 to find out if it might be a SWAT team going for a wrong address (or right address if Eric Holder is president) is a risk I would like to exclude before I light them up.

 

[Sonya_6]

Step one: Get the mastiff in the house because in this area they are probably cops, and my dogs are NOT a free shoot.

Step two: Go out to investigate, start by yelling out "Y'all need some help?" No point in being armed, I couldn't win a gunfight with a group of armed/organized men using just a handgun, and I sure as heck wouldn't go out sporting a shotgun.

In this area they won't be a band of criminals, and if they were criminals they wouldn't be stopped studying a map (there are 3 homes on this 4 mile stretch of road), nor would they be targeting my house. If they were in fact criminals I would give them directions to whichever residence they were looking for (if a gang of criminals decided to target a neighbor they likely have good reason). I would not call 911 to ask because I seriously doubt if a 911 operator would tell me about an impending swat raid or put me in touch with the officers involved.

I would assume they are law enforcement and if they decide to light me up when I walked out there it would probably be a career ending decision on their part (especially since I would be unarmed) therefore I would take the risk. Better to meet them on the road rather than have them target the wrong house and kill my dogs as well as myself (and they likely would have to once the poop hit the fan).

 

[backlash]

I have been close to a situation like you described.
It was only 7 PM but already dark.
I see a bunch of people just outside my back yard in the woods.
They did have flashlights but I couldn't ID who they were.
Finally I lit them up with my spotlight.
I saw a bunch of green jackets that had Green River Task Force on the back.
I quickly turned off my spotlight.
My son and the neighbor kids had found a dead girl and called 911.
He didn't say anything because he thought he would be in trouble.
He was, but not for why he thought.
Turned out to not be a Green River killing. It was a girl killed by her step dad and dumped.
It took the police about 20 minutes to solve that killing.

If your scenario happens where I live now it will most likely be the local SWAT team after one of the many gang bangers and or drug dealers that live around here.
My wife went to the store and got close to a SWAT raid on a grow operation.
Seems like the illegals think if they put black plastic around their pot filed the police won't know what they are doing.
They are always wrong about that.

 

[CrackbottomLouis]

Insure door locked, tell wife to call 911 while I throw on my vest, ear and eye pro and grab the AR. I can have that stuff on in 10 seconds. Take defensive position where I can cover the 2 entrances to my home. Tell wife to take cover (not concealment) in the secure spot while staying on phone with authorities.

 

[The Lazy L]

We have a "what if" already plan that would work for this scenario.

- What is your first move?
I hand the wife my cell phone. She lays down on the floor with the bed between her and the bedroom door. She calls 911 and stays on line with them. I pickup the shotgun and lock the bedroom door. Then I kneel beside the wife. From my location I can see out the bedroom window to watch the group at the end of my driveway. AND anyone making a bad decision by breaking though the bedroom door I can deal with. Our bedroom door is a 180 degree turn at the top of the stairs, a perfect bottle neck.

Now if I was home alone...we have a means to exit the house unseen...On my way to exit the house I traded the shotgun for the Tavor...work my way slowly though the woods to flank them and get within hearing distance. If their conversation sounds legit or not I would remain hidden until they leave or if they approached my house I still wouldn't reveal my position. If they aren't legit and leave their vehicles unguarded all of their tires could be flat when they return. I am concerned about thermal or night scopes they may have, so I could regret that I left the house. Thermal or night scopes will not work though the house walls.

- Do you notify the authorities or not?
Yes.

- Do you turn the lights on or keep them off?
I leave them off. I'm not going to advertise that their presence is known.

- Do you try to engage the group verbally?
No.

- What next?
Wait and watch.

 

[havasu]

Well, since April 22 has come and gone, it appears we all made the correct move!

I think these scenarios are very thought provoking, and I appreciate them.

 

[OBG 57]

Today we get the one where a guy walks into burger king in his girlfriends thong with a ball bat

 

[TMT Tactical]

Today we get the one where a guy walks into burger king in his girlfriends thong with a ball bat

Thanks for that not so pleasant mental visual.

 

[ssonb]

OBG that was one of those TMI moments....we need a shutter smiliee here.

 

[OBG 57]

OBG that was one of those TMI moments....we need a shutter smiliee here.

Never think it can't happen ! that dude that just shot up the pancake place was nude except for a jacket,nut jobs everywhere

 

[fteter]

- What is your first move?
Actually arm myself while simultaneously waking the wife. Arms would be the CZ-82 that lives in my nightstand drawer and the Savage Axis II XP. My wife would back up with a Remington 1100 20 gauge loaded with #3 Buck and her Bersa in .380.
- Do you notify the authorities or not?
Yes. I call to inform them of the potential incident and inquire whether or not the folks outside were acting on local police authority
- Do you turn the lights on or keep them off?
I keep them off. I can already see them. Why negate that advantage by letting them see me or know I'm awake?
- Do you try to engage the group verbally?
Not unless they approach my home. Then I'll verbally engage, letting them know that they've come close enough and now need to state their business - I'll do that just as the outer security lights kick on to light them up.
- What next?
I keep an eye of the group. Ask the wife to try calling that neighbor on the other side of this bunch...maybe we can get a crossfire going if it comes to that. I also send the wife to the basement gun safe to bring up the two SKS rifles (If we're going to have a skirmish, I intend to have plenty of firepower), then I send her to hide in the basement...with her guns.