Political Correctness in the US Army Special Forces

[Come and Take It]

I talked to a buddy of mine who is a Green 'Beenie' Beret.

He told me a story about coming back from an FTX (Field Training Exercise)
and driving up on a Security Checkpoint, as he described it, a chubby female with a
thick neck, came out of the guard house to check the ID's of all personal in vehicle.

She greeted my friend, "Good morning SGT, how is your day going?"

His reply was simple: AR 600-9

He is an E-7 SFC, the 2nd highest ranking NCO in the vehicle,
there were officers in the vehicle as well.

They tore him a new A$$ Hole for this alleged breach of decorum and he was
verbally reprimanded for sexual harassment !

WTFO !

Even the SPec OPS Community is being reduced to a bunch of REMF's !

Rear Echelon Mother....

 

[Loomis]

I talked to a buddy of mine who is a Green 'Beenie' Beret.

He told me a story about coming back from an FTX (Field Training Exercise)
and driving up on a Security Checkpoint, as he described it, a chubby female with a
thick neck, came out of the guard house to check the ID's of all personal in vehicle.

She greeted my friend, "Good morning SGT, how is your day going?"

His reply was simple: AR 600-9

He is an E-7 SFC, the 2nd highest ranking NCO in the vehicle,
there were officers in the vehicle as well.

They tore him a new A$$ Hole for this alleged breach of decorum and he was
verbally reprimanded for sexual harassment !

WTFO !

Even the SPec OPS Community is being reduced to a bunch of REMF's !

Rear Echelon Mother....

I would have done more then that. I would have given your friend an instant Article 15 with a reprimand to his Commanding Officer. His remark was uncalled for and shows a total lack of respect for a fellow soldier, female or not, and no, I wasn't an REMF, I was a heavy combat vet. Your friend shows lack of professionalism. Personally I don't think he was funny. However that's my opinion.

 

[old_anorak]

I back Loomis on this one. Uncalled for and demeaning. He's lucky he didn't end up with worse.

 

[Clyde]

I talked to a buddy of mine who is a Green 'Beenie' Beret.

He told me a story about coming back from an FTX (Field Training Exercise)
and driving up on a Security Checkpoint, as he described it, a chubby female with a
thick neck, came out of the guard house to check the ID's of all personal in vehicle.

She greeted my friend, "Good morning SGT, how is your day going?"

His reply was simple: AR 600-9

He is an E-7 SFC, the 2nd highest ranking NCO in the vehicle,
there were officers in the vehicle as well.

They tore him a new A$$ Hole for this alleged breach of decorum and he was
verbally reprimanded for sexual harassment !

WTFO !

Even the SPec OPS Community is being reduced to a bunch of REMF's !

Rear Echelon Mother....

This has nothing to do with political correctness and everything to do with respect of a fellow soldier.
If I had the power your "friend" would be given a field grade article 15, kicked out of group and sent packing back to Leg Land.

 

[jayjay1]

Your buddy seems to have forgotten that times are changing. Not sure how things were your way, but down under, this behaviour is now not tolerated in the defence force. As a favourite saying of mine goes ' Better to close your mouth and be thought a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt'.

 

[Come and Take It]

I guess it's a different Army now from when I served?

Apply the same standard if he had said the same thing to a male soldier who didn't meet the standard

The PC crowd in the US Military is already looking at how to modify the standards for females to get get "Tabbed"

They tried at Sapper School, didn't work

 

[Loomis]

Back in 1968 on Hill 54 in Vietnam, we where under heavy attack. We started to get overun. I saw a young petite Army nurse jump on the back of a Quad 50 and let loose all four Ma Duce's. Cut me a new respect for women in the military right on the spot.
However in my research of my distant ancestors, I find I had many ancestral Grand Mothers who fought alongside my ancestral Grandfathers, on horses, with bows and arrow, and swords. Female warriors are nothing new, just nobody lived that long to tell about it.

 

[ARMY127]

I guess it's a different Army now from when I served?

Apply the same standard if he had said the same thing to a male soldier who didn't meet the standard

The PC crowd in the US Military is already looking at how to modify the standards for females to get get "Tabbed"

They tried at Sapper School, didn't work

I was in from 1994-2012 (with a break in service 6 years Active, 3 Reserve, 6 National Guard, both Navy and Army). I have seen many things, been in quite a bit of combat. I was a Blackhawk Crew Chief and Gunner and Aircrew/Gunner, on Seahawks. Deployed quite a few times as well, and 2 tours in Iraq. I was injured during my 2nd tour and was Medically Retired due to severe Cervical Spine injuries, and a torn up Right Shoulder. The Army is not different, although in some ways it is, your friend was totally inappropriate and definitely deserved to be reprimanded. Maybe later privately with his buddies a joke would be ok but not in front of the soldier and in front of officers. I worked quite a bit with Special Ops in both the Navy and Army, and they are mostly great people that are put in harms way a lot more than regular military', but some are definitely cocky A-Holes that think they are above everything. So in any time or any year your friend was completely out of line. Sorry

 

[Maverick]

I enlisted in 75 even then we wouldn't have gotten away with that

 

[Roninsensei]

Sexual harassment No. Disrespect of a fellow soldier YES. I do think though that the reaction would have been less if it were a male soldier he made the comment to. It still deserved a reprimand. Sex does not matter but respect does! Hell my grandfather would have drug him out of the transport and whooped his a$$ for it. (WWII Ranger) But I have to agree with his point of, if this was a male it would have been less of a fit. Unfortunately for your friend and his complete lack of respect judgement and tact hes gonna be made an example of, and rightfully so.

 

[Come and Take It]

Sexual harassment No. Disrespect of a fellow soldier YES. I do think though that the reaction would have been less if it were a male soldier he made the comment to. It still deserved a reprimand. Sex does not matter but respect does! Hell my grandfather would have drug him out of the transport and whooped his a$$ for it. (WWII Ranger) But I have to agree with his point of, if this was a male it would have been less of a fit. Unfortunately for your friend and his complete lack of respect judgement and tact hes gonna be made an example of, and rightfully so.

The SPEC Community is a different breed.
By breaking out a section of the Army Regs,
to a soldier who doesn't meet the standard is out of line?

I finished my tour of duty in a Signal Unit, I had a female platoon sgt.

Nothing stopped her, as a leader of troops from squaring any soldier away who
failed to meet the standards as outline in AR-600. In the new Army, well what was new
in 2000, profanity was prohibited, yet that never stopped her or any leader from busting out
a litany of 4 letter words.

So an E7 cannot not do an on the spot correction, referencing the Book of Standards?

This is why I bailed with 15 years, Medical Discharge, I could have stayed in, however,
the way things have changed, there was no way I could have done 1 more day, let alone 5 years.

When I was in the 40th ID, Ca Army National Guard, I was on the State QRF, which was a combination of
all Military Reserve Forces, several females tried to part of the team, they failed the Standards. By myself or
higher ups referring to the AR, regardless of what standard they failed, was that out of line? Yes male soldiers washed
out as well, failing the same standards.

 

[Maverick]

The SPEC Community is a different breed.
By breaking out a section of the Army Regs,
to a soldier who doesn't meet the standard is out of line?

I finished my tour of duty in a Signal Unit, I had a female platoon sgt.

Nothing stopped her, as a leader of troops from squaring any soldier away who
failed to meet the standards as outline in AR-600. In the new Army, well what was new
in 2000, profanity was prohibited, yet that never stopped her or any leader from busting out
a litany of 4 letter words.

So an E7 cannot not do an on the spot correction, referencing the Book of Standards?

This is why I bailed with 15 years, Medical Discharge, I could have stayed in, however,
the way things have changed, there was no way I could have done 1 more day, let alone 5 years.

When I was in the 40th ID, Ca Army National Guard, I was on the State QRF, which was a combination of
all Military Reserve Forces, several females tried to part of the team, they failed the Standards. By myself or
higher ups referring to the AR, regardless of what standard they failed, was that out of line? Yes male soldiers washed
out as well, failing the same standards.

As an NCO and the Soldier is serving under me then I would say something within regulation, from my understanding this wasn't the case, she was not in the command structure of the SFC, Officers was also in the vehicle, in this circumstances it would have been up to the officers to have said something not the SFC, Generally the Officer would ask her name and rank and gone through the chain of command if they felt the need too.

 

[Roninsensei]

What he did was designed to embarrass not command a regulation! Common! Use a little common sense. He's being punished because he was stupid and attempted to embarrass a fellow soldier. What so hard to understand?

 

[Clyde]

I was in the 40th ID, Ca Army National Guard

I was with with 40th ID, 40th MP CO from Sept 2002 - 2004

 

[Come and Take It]

1 30 deuce Engineers, 4/160 INF (M) in da hood of Santa Ana, 532 Engr.

 

[Clyde]

1 30 deuce Engineers, 4/160 INF (M) in da hood of Santa Ana, 532 Engr.

I was at Los Al.

 

[Bravery]

Wow, when I read the story I laughed! I guess I looked at things differently. Mind you I am overweight too. I am certain I would have received even more than that comment from him if I were still in the Army. I know I would have hated hearing it and I would have thought "what a PR*CK!!!", but sometimes saying something the way he did is better than just coming out and saying "You are FAT, OVERWEIGHT, BLOATED, and DISGUSTING." Sometimes being blunt like that will shock someone into change.

I know some people that are in Special Forces units and YES ... they can be REAL *SSHOLES! I always believe that they should be given more latitude for what they go through (IMHO). My son just started a project for history... he chose to do a project on Patton. I was talking with him about what kind of man Patton was ... He was (again IMHO) one of America's finest generals and he was a real SOB too. I told him how he got taken down a few pegs when he slapped the soldier that was suffering from Combat Fatigue (I think that's what they called it then). Now, I'm really going to stop before I really step on toes. I hope I still have one friend out there.

I guess what I'm saying is 1. that would have probably helped me get in motivated and in the mindset to lose weight and 2. many of those pricks in Special Forces should be give some leeway (just my humble opinion).

 

[old_anorak]

I can see what you are saying Bravery. I come from a military family and there seemed to be things that were just not done. I suppose not considered honorable is the best way I can say it. I, myself am not military, but there is a time and a place for things in my simple opinion. Maybe I'm wrong on that.

 

[Bravery]

I agree... he was an ass!!!!!But, remember he gets paid for killing people... not for passing out warm fuzzys and cotton candy. Please, let me know if I'm off base here.

 

[old_anorak]

You may not be off base at all. It just smacks of nothing honorable in his behavior and again, it's just my opinion. Being paid to kill people doesn't give you an automatic pass on civility. Don't mind me tonight, I'm a little cranky, one of the cops gave me a hard time tonight while I was in town with my kid.

 

[Maverick]

The difference though he was on base, there is a certain professional protocol then if he was in a field of operation, I have worked with SF, Delta and SAS and never seen anything out of line and certainly not ass-holes, in fact I have seen them come to the aid of anyone they felt was being wronged, picked on miss-treated soldier and civilian a like, I have never seen these guys reprimand any soldier that wasn't part of their team in any theater of operations including bragg, benning, ft. lewis and sherman, sexual harassment may be over the top in this case but we wasn't there and only receiving one side of what had happen but I will agree that P/C has gotten way out of hand and should not be part of the military.

SSG 75th Rangers 2nd Battalion 1975-88

 

[69Powerwagon]

The funniest thing I found about military reg weight was the height weight ratio, who the hell did they design that for? scrawny bean poles? When I entered the navy I was put on the fat boy program despite being extremely active in swimming,wrestling,judo and soccer. All because I was 5' 10" and weighed 215 despite having under 8% body fat at the time. As to your buddy being an ass, well his only mistake in my opinion was doing it in front of the officers. People need to be reprimanded for looking like sh*tbirds that's why the regs are there, but you don't do it in front of the O's where it could hurt that persons career.