Helpful Info. Chlorine Dioxide is not a miracle, its just wonderful chemistry

[GeorgiaPeachie]

I literally just said it's not an argument for CD, but okay.

And not only that, you are the one who brought up bleach.

I'm done here.

Just ignore and block. Arguing is so not worth your time.

 

[GaRp58]

Can it be done? Absolutely. That is the purpose of prepping though, so that you can but, hopefully won't have to!

Absolutely, the most of us do eat much more than we really need. If you adjust your intake to your daily output and needs, you can stretch yourself to the so-called "7%" body fat level and do quite well.
Much of the cancer problems which do not stem from contact with cancer causing chemicals, have to do with an over-intake of protein-giving cancer cells the needed food to survive. An acidic level in our bodies (like with CDS) can be so controlled that almost no cancer can survive because it needs an alkaline level to live.
The thousand calorie food intake is usually enough for us normal working, getting older, non-superstar persons.
The three thousand calorie diet needed by soldiers carrying 60 and more lbs. of equipment and walking or running around in a wartime environment is also just as real.

 

[Survivor_316]

Absolutely, the most of us do eat much more than we really need. If you adjust your intake to your daily output and needs, you can stretch yourself to the so-called "7%" body fat level and do quite well.
Much of the cancer problems which do not stem from contact with cancer causing chemicals, have to do with an over-intake of protein-giving cancer cells the needed food to survive. An acidic level in our bodies (like with CDS) can be so controlled that almost no cancer can survive because it needs an alkaline level to live.
The thousand calorie food intake is usually enough for us normal working, getting older, non-superstar persons.
The three thousand calorie diet needed by soldiers carrying 60 and more lbs. of equipment and walking or running around in a wartime environment is also just as real.

Absolutely this. (Except I agree, acid/alkaline was flipped... though, cancer can survive in either. It creates its own acidic environment, so it won't immediately die off from an alkaline environment, unfortunately.)

Fasting is one of the BEST ways to help control and prevent cancer.

The problem from a cancer standpoint and food shortages would be less fresh foods and more reliance on preserved meats. Meats salted with modern preserving salts can cause stomach and colon cancer. We all need salt, but not man made salt. If you need to salt meat, choose natural salts.

You probably know all of this, but I'm writing it in case it helps someone else post-SHTF. Make sure you have a LOT of natural salts.

Sorry I got on another rant. I'm pretty bad about that, aren't I??

 

[DrHenley]

Absolutely this. (Except I agree, acid/alkaline was flipped... though, cancer can survive in either. It creates its own acidic environment, so it won't immediately die off from an alkaline environment, unfortunately.)

Fasting is one of the BEST ways to help control and prevent cancer.

The problem from a cancer standpoint and food shortages would be less fresh foods and more reliance on preserved meats. Meats salted with modern preserving salts can cause stomach and colon cancer. We all need salt, but not man made salt. If you need to salt meat, choose natural salts.

You probably know all of this, but I'm writing it in case it helps someone else post-SHTF. Make sure you have a LOT of natural salts.

Sorry I got on another rant. I'm pretty bad about that, aren't I??

I'm not a microbiologist, so this is not an "expert analysis"...but from what I can gather, acid produced by the cancer cell is what causes CDS to release oxygen ions as a free radicals. Unlike a lot of ionic compounds such as salt, water does not cause CDS to dissociate into ions. So it travels through the bloodstream as an intact molecule until it comes in contact with acid, and then it splits into ions. The free oxygen radicals then attack the source of the acid. This is the mechanism of how it "targets" cancer cells and microbes and how it can be so specific.

 

[DrHenley]

Found the answer: Chlorine Dioxide does not dissociate in hydrochloric acid (stomach acid) at a pH of 2 or above. You'd have to have a really bad case of acid indigestion for your stomach acid to be much below a pH of 2.

Now...Back to our regularly scheduled broadcast.

 

[GaRp58]

I think you inverted acidic and alkaline. Cancer needs an acidic level to live.

Not so PP. The acidic content of CDS is that which prevents cancer, kills bacteria and virus by actually BURNING thru their fatty cells walls and destroying them completely instead of trying to kill them with antibiotics, which, if not enough or not long enough taken, will just make the bacteria resistant.
High acidic levels makes it impossible for cancer and others to live.
Maybe it is just doing its job at OXIDIZING the bad stuff.
CDS is positively charged and will not be attracted to the positive and healthy body cells. Bad virus and bacteria are negatively charged and draw the CDS to themselves thru a "magnetic" sort of way. The positive charged and good bacteria in your intestines will not be harmed by CDS as with antibiotics, where you must re-build your intestinal flora after an antibiotic treatment.
I am speaking from the many years of learning and teaching in Germany about CDS back when it was only called MMS and Jim Humble described the happenings of how so many yellow fever and malaria patients in Africa were being healed and helped with MMS. He sent the info to a friend in Harvard and was so informed.
I do hope so that is how I learned and hope that I have not been teaching wrong for over a decade and a half and using CDS for survival for 2 decades after only using it to clean and disinfect my water tanks, water lines and stored water in my camping trailer and preps.
As I think about it, it should be the oxidization of the bad virus and bacteria which is happening as MMS is a mild to strong bleaching agent according to how it is mixed.

 

[DrHenley]

CDS has confounded the majority of professional chemists and microbiologists in the world, so I don't pretend to fully understand it. But I do know that when it comes in contact with a strong acid (pH below 2) it dissociates into oxygen ions (free radicals) and chlorine ions. Free radicals is one of the mechanisms your immune system uses to attack pathogens. That's not up for debate. pH alone does not explain the behavior of chlorine dioxide.

Caveat: It's been 50 years since I took my chemistry classes and then did research that involved a totally different area of biochemistry and microbiology. CDS is not even an organic compound and most of the reactions are with chemicals that are not organic (containing carbon) so even though it is involved in biochemistry, it falls outside of the realm of organic chemistry (chemistry of hydrocarbons mostly). Organic, and inorganic chemistry are two different worlds entirely, and I was in the realm of organic chemistry.

Now, having veered off once again from the subject of the OP...let's get back to the original topic or we may have to lock this thread.

 

[Survivor_316]

@GaRp58 @Proud Prepper @DrHenley

Can we continue the pH & ionic charge conversation here? I am trying to suss it all out.

I know Reactive Oxygen Species/free radicals/oxidative stress can both cause and kill cancer cells, so I'm interested in this topic.

I was a microbio major for 3 years but that was during my dark ages, so I learned enough to do damage but not enough to be intelligent in the topic!

From my understanding about molecule charge, it depends on both the chemical structure and the pH of its surrounding solution. So, cancer cells produce an acidic environment whereas normal cells do not... but their internal pH is actually more alkaline than a typical cell.

Interstitial fluid=acidic, within membrane=alkaline.

I think I need to dust off a biochem book for this.

*I wasn't a biochem major. Microbio. I was thinking about my biochem classes and mistyped.

 

[DrHenley]

My understanding is that it is that acidic interstitial fluid that "activates" the chlorine dioxide. Once the oxygen free radical is released, it attacks the cell wall of microbes such as bacteria and fungi or the protective shell of viruses. It is nearly impossible for a microbe to evolve resistance to this. I say "nearly" because some gram-positive bacteria such as Lactobacillus and Bacillus bacteria do have resistance due to a thicker cell wall. (which would explain why beneficial intestinal flora aren't killed by chlorine dioxide.)
In microbes, the cell wall is separate from, and outside of the cell membrane. Animals do not have cell walls they only have cell membranes. Chlorine dioxide passes through cell membranes intact, which explains how it can get to intracellular viruses.

 

[Survivor_316]

My understanding is that it is that acidic interstitial fluid that "activates" the chlorine dioxide. Once the oxygen free radical is released, it attacks the cell wall of microbes such as bacteria and fungi or the protective shell of viruses. It is nearly impossible for a microbe to evolve resistance to this. I say "nearly" because some gram-positive bacteria such as Lactobacillus and Bacillus bacteria do have resistance due to a thicker cell wall. (which would explain why beneficial intestinal flora aren't killed by chlorine dioxide.)
In microbes, the cell wall is separate from, and outside of the cell membrane. Animals do not have cell walls they only have cell membranes. Chlorine dioxide passes through cell membranes intact, which explains how it can get to intracellular viruses.

So by your understanding, it would dissociate in in the interstitial fluid, not within the cell of mammals? I didn't understand because of the comment that it passes through cell membranes intact. Or was that only in healthy cells with a proper balance of pH and ionic charges?

In my (very rudimentary) understanding of ionic exchange and angiogenesis, etc., that kind of makes sense since a free radical is simply an unstable molecule which readily bonds to others. The bonding process creates the damage to the cell.

If this is the case, it would by necessity change the ionic exchange dynamic between the inside and outside of the membrane, which is essentially what many other cytotoxic therapies do.

I still don't quite understand the pH being the catalyst for the disassociation either though, as the pH of the interstitial fluid wouldn't be as low as 2, would it? I have tried researching but I'm only coming up with complex chemistry equations that I likely couldn't balance 20 years ago, let alone now.

 

[DrHenley]

I still don't quite understand the pH being the catalyst for the disassociation either though, as the pH of the interstitial fluid wouldn't be as low as 2, would it? I have tried researching but I'm only coming up with complex chemistry equations that I likely couldn't balance 20 years ago, let alone now.

You have to understand that the interstitial fluid is not uniform. The bulk pH may be only as low as 6, but there is a gradient with the lowest pH right at the cell wall where lactate is being pumped into the interstitial fluid. This makes perfect sense because that's right where you need the chlorine dioxide to do its thing.

They have other proposed mechanisms for the action of chlorine dioxide on microbes and viruses, such as breaking disulfide bonds directly, but I don't think that would be a selective mechanism. And chlorine dioxide does appear to have some type of selective mechanism.

And I must repeat, this is not, I repeat NOT an expert analysis because this is not and never has been my area of expertise. Even in my area of expertise I am way past the "Use By" date. LOL

 

[Survivor_316]

You have to understand that the interstitial fluid is not uniform. The bulk pH may be only as low as 6, but there is a gradient with the lowest pH right at the cell wall where lactate is being pumped into the interstitial fluid. This makes perfect sense because that's right where you need the chlorine dioxide to do its thing.

They have other proposed mechanisms for the action of chlorine dioxide on microbes and viruses, such as breaking disulfide bonds directly, but I don't think that would be a selective mechanism. And chlorine dioxide does appear to have some type of selective mechanism.

And I must repeat, this is not, I repeat NOT an expert analysis because this is not and never has been my area of expertise. Even in my area of expertise I am way past the "Use By" date. LOL

Ah. That makes sense about the gradient of the interstitial fluid.

Hey, I think this discussion wasn't too shabby for two folks who aren't qualified to analyze such things! Lol

I do think even a killing of viruses and fungi has a benefit for cancer, so I think I might continue to research this some. Thanks for your help!

 

[GaRp58]

Ok, you mean acidic in the context of how CDS works.

yes, the CDS eats thru the cell walls of any bad virus or bacteria and destroys it from turning it inside out. This is also why if you take a too strong dose, you get cramps, headaches and nausea. The poisons in the pathogens are circulating in your bloodstream and need to be filtered out.
Back to the topic like Doc said.....

 

[DrHenley]

I probably need to mention this:
Normally when we think of acids, we think of things like hydrochloric acid (HCL), sulfuric acid(H2SO4), nitric acid (HNO3), carbonic acid (H2CO3), etc. that have an H+ ion (proton) they can contribute. These are what are technically known as Brønsted–Lowry acids. These acids freely dissociate into H+ ions and negative ions in water, water also being an ionic molecule that can dissociate into H+ and OH- ions..

Which of these is not like the others: HCL, H2SO4, HNO3, H2CO3, ClO2?

In order to get a proton from ClO2, you'd need to split a nucleus - nuclear fission! This is one reason why chlorine dioxide, despite being ionic, and being acidic, does not freely dissociate in water the way most acids do. And it is one of the reasons chlorine dioxide doesn't always behave the way we expect it to.

Pure chlorine dioxide gas is acidic, yet there are no H+ ions anywhere to be found, so pH (based on concentration of H+ ions) is meaningless.

So an alternate definition of acid is the Lewis Acid, which instead of being defined as something that can contribute a proton (ClO2 has none to give), it is defined as something that can accept a pair of electrons.

 

[Survivor_316]

I probably need to mention this:
Normally when we think of acids, we think of things like hydrochloric acid (HCL), sulfuric acid(H2SO4), nitric acid (HNO3), carbonic acid (H2CO3), etc. that have an H+ ion (proton) they can contribute. These are what are technically known as Brønsted–Lowry acids. These acids freely dissociate into H+ ions and negative ions in water, water also being an ionic molecule that can dissociate into H+ and OH- ions..

Which of these is not like the others: HCL, H2SO4, HNO3, H2CO3, ClO2?

In order to get a proton from CLO2, you'd need to split a nucleus - nuclear fission! This is one reason why chlorine dioxide, despite being ionic, and being acidic, does not freely dissociate in water the way most acids do. And it is one of the reasons chlorine dioxide doesn't always behave the way we expect it to.

Pure chlorine dioxide gas is acidic, yet there are no H+ ions anywhere to be found, so pH (based on concentration of H+ ions) is meaningless.

So an alternate definition of acid is the Lewis Acid, which instead of being defined as something that can contribute a proton (CLO2 has none to give), it is defined as something that can accept a pair of electrons.

Ah! That makes a lot of sense.

Interesting because I just read that fulvic acid has something like 14 tetra trillion available electrons. Not that that has anything to do with CDS.


This makes me wonder if small amounts of CDS would be better in an IV, rather than ingesting, to lessen the ionic exchanges. (Note: before anyone lectures me, I'm not planning on doing this.) I don't know anything about saline solution and it's chemical structure, though. Now you have me actually interested in chemistry.

What is happening to me?

 

[Proud Prepper]

Ah! That makes a lot of sense.

Interesting because I just read that fulvic acid has something like 14 tetra trillion available electrons. Not that that has anything to do with CDS.


This makes me wonder if small amounts of CDS would be better in an IV, rather than ingesting, to lessen the ionic exchanges. (Note: before anyone lectures me, I'm not planning on doing this.) I don't know anything about saline solution and it's chemical structure, though. Now you have me actually interested in chemistry.

What is happening to me?

Protocol Y = Abbreviated Injection (for physicians only)
1. Protocol C is generally performed at least once before starting parenterally.
2. Perform a venous blood gasometry in order to determine the patient's status
3. Preparation: 1-2 ml of CDS (0,3%) is added for every 100 ml of 0,9% NACL physiological saline. Isotonic.
4. Typical adult dose 5ml CDS (0,3%) in 500 ml 0,9% NaCl IV [Equivalent to 45 mg (= 0,0045%)] (if necessary, the dose can be doubled).
5. Measure the pH with a calibrated digital pH meter, which must be between pH 7,4- pH 7,8. to avoid phlebitis.
6. If it is lower, buffer with sodium bicarbonate.
7. IV drip rate = slow: between 4 and 8h with 500ml.
8. Another venous blood gas to determine post IV status
9. It is advisable to use different routes in different extremities each day.
10.Typical duration 4 consecutive days.
11. After two hours, the patient can continue with protocol C until recovered.

 

[Survivor_316]

Protocol Y = Abbreviated Injection (for physicians only)
1. Protocol C is generally performed at least once before starting parenterally.
2. Perform a venous blood gasometry in order to determine the patient's status
3. Preparation: 1-2 ml of CDS (0,3%) is added for every 100 ml of 0,9% NACL physiological saline. Isotonic.
4. Typical adult dose 5ml CDS (0,3%) in 500 ml 0,9% NaCl IV [Equivalent to 45 mg (= 0,0045%)] (if necessary, the dose can be doubled).
5. Measure the pH with a calibrated digital pH meter, which must be between pH 7,4- pH 7,8. to avoid phlebitis.
6. If it is lower, buffer with sodium bicarbonate.
7. IV drip rate = slow: between 4 and 8h with 500ml.
8. Another venous blood gas to determine post IV status
9. It is advisable to use different routes in different extremities each day.
10.Typical duration 4 consecutive days.
11. After two hours, the patient can continue with protocol C until recovered.

Wow. 4-8 drip for 4 consecutive days. That sounds unpleasant.

 

[Dani]

Mike Adam’s demonstrates how to make chlorine dioxide solution starting at around 15 minutes in using MMS and the activator.

https://www.brighteon.com/b0049f6a-c7c8-4bd8-a417-4f265507038f

 

[Proud Prepper]

Mike Adam’s demonstrates how to make chloride dioxin solution starting at around 15 minutes in using MMS and the activator.

https://www.brighteon.com/b0049f6a-c7c8-4bd8-a417-4f265507038f

That's how I make, except I use a bigger container.

 

[Proud Prepper]

I picked up 4 bags. There's 500 in a bag. So many uses.

 

[Dani]

I picked up 4 bags. There's 500 in a bag. So many uses.

We had ordered 2 of these bags a couple weeks ago from Safrax Chlorine Dioxide Clo2 tablets - high purity in contact with water. They are on back order and will take anywhere between 6-8 weeks to get here. I thought I posted about it, maybe in another link or maybe not. It’s only $30 for 500 tablets.

 

[Proud Prepper]

We had ordered 2 of these bags a couple weeks ago from Safrax Chlorine Dioxide Clo2 tablets - high purity in contact with water. They are on back order and will take anywhere between 6-8 weeks to get here. I thought I posted about it, maybe in another link or maybe not. It’s only $30 for 500 tablets.

I got mine in today You should be getting yours.

 

[Cindyd]

I just ordered 2 bags myself

 

[Cindyd]

That's how I make, except I use a bigger container.

Thnx for posting this PP...I've been looking for info on this and couldn't find it..I'm sure you've posted more than once over time, but I couldn't find it.

 

[Cindyd]

Ordered 8/7. Arrived today! What is that 6 weeks? Give or take?

 

[GeorgiaPeachie]

I got mine in today You should be getting yours.

Can you give me the link to the one you bought please?

 

[Cindyd]

GP, here is where I ordered from...its the link danil posted previously:

Safrax Chlorine Dioxide Clo2 tablets - Water purification
https://safrax.com/
PP can confirm for sure, but from his previous post, appears it's where he ordered from also?

 

[Proud Prepper]

GP, here is where I ordered from...its the link danil posted previously:

Safrax Chlorine Dioxide Clo2 tablets - Water purification
https://safrax.com/
PP can confirm for sure, but from his previous post, appears it's where he ordered from also?

That's correct. I'm using it like crazy. So many uses.

 

[GeorgiaPeachie]

Not to sound outright stupid, but I have that link but am unsure of what to order. The picture you posted PP is not on that website. I see 3 options on it. None like what you posted…

 

[Proud Prepper]

Not to sound outright stupid, but I have that link but am unsure of what to order. The picture you posted PP is not on that website. I see 3 options on it. None like what you posted…

They have 4 products. There the same except for strength. I believe 2 are identical just different marketing packages.
They are probably out of that one. Call them and ask the differences if you can't find out online.