Rant about very common survival advice

[DrPrepper]

This is my rant about the survival advice of many ‘experts.’ Just again today I read a survival expert say when the world collapses to go into the mountains to survive. Everyone always plans on going into the mountains.

Every year at this time, our emergency department fills up with people who come up to the mountains to get away from the heat in Phoenix. People do not realize they need to become acclimated to the altitude. While I'm not as high as Hiwall (we're only about 6500 feet), there is a significant impact from trying to breathe at high altitudes when you are not used to it. In the event of a SHTF situation, people who think they will just go to the mountains (which as Hiwall pointed out are not necessarily conducive to an easy life) are in for a big surprise as they try to do all of their everyday activities in a harsh and unwelcoming environment, with bodies already stressed from the situation..... and then have to try to breathe, too! It just won't work. If I had a dollar for every flatlander who comes up here and gets sick as a dog from altitude sickness, well, I would be able to retire and build my dream castle - on the mountain, of course!

 

[joel]

 

[hiwall]

Every year at this time, our emergency department fills up with people who come up to the mountains to get away from the heat in Phoenix. People do not realize they need to become acclimated to the altitude. While I'm not as high as Hiwall (we're only about 6500 feet), there is a significant impact from trying to breathe at high altitudes when you are not used to it. In the event of a SHTF situation, people who think they will just go to the mountains (which as Hiwall pointed out are not necessarily conducive to an easy life) are in for a big surprise as they try to do all of their everyday activities in a harsh and unwelcoming environment, with bodies already stressed from the situation..... and then have to try to breathe, too! It just won't work. If I had a dollar for every flatlander who comes up here and gets sick as a dog from altitude sickness, well, I would be able to retire and build my dream castle - on the mountain, of course!

Years ago when I went on my first elk hunt in Wyoming, we camped at close to 10,000 ft. At the time our house was at 550 feet so it was quite a change. I didn't really get sick but I was mostly lethargic for a couple days. After that I was mostly okay. Though at that time I was also in my prime which I'm sure helped. I had also worked out a lot beforehand to get ready for the hunt.

 

[Weedygarden]

Every year at this time, our emergency department fills up with people who come up to the mountains to get away from the heat in Phoenix. People do not realize they need to become acclimated to the altitude. While I'm not as high as Hiwall (we're only about 6500 feet), there is a significant impact from trying to breathe at high altitudes when you are not used to it. In the event of a SHTF situation, people who think they will just go to the mountains (which as Hiwall pointed out are not necessarily conducive to an easy life) are in for a big surprise as they try to do all of their everyday activities in a harsh and unwelcoming environment, with bodies already stressed from the situation..... and then have to try to breathe, too! It just won't work. If I had a dollar for every flatlander who comes up here and gets sick as a dog from altitude sickness, well, I would be able to retire and build my dream castle - on the mountain, of course!

In Colorado, there are stories every year of people who fly into DIA, drive up to the mountains to ski, and some die. While I live in the Front Range, I always get a headache when I go to the mountains for more than a day.

I always wanted a log cabin in the mountains. I even wanted to build it myself, with help as needed. It had great appeal to me, being in nature, away from crowds. Then there were wildfires, and people lost their homes. Few homes survived in the fire areas.

I became aware that it is not easy to grow food in the mountains. It is not easy living there. People who are not used to living in the mountains do not last there long. Give most Texans 3 years at best, and they are gone.

Why is it that people want to head to the mountains in a SHTF situation? They have not thought that idea out. A woman I know was terrified when Trump was elected. She told me she wanted to buy a place in the mountains. She would not last there more than a day or two. She doesn't even do yard work, or anything that might get her dirty. It is people like that who will have a really hard time, SHTF.

 

[Caribou]

It is not just the mountains. People go everywhere and don't know the rules and what they are doing. Years ago some fool came to Alaska and moved into the bush to live the mountain man life. He died and a book and movie portraying him as a hero came out. He went into the woods with few skills and little sense and got himself killed. Tourists still hike into his bus to see where he died.

If you want a good price on a sailboat go to Hawaii. People head out across the ocean and find out that this is not the life for them. A friend of mine sold his boat over there and that trip messed him up but he came out of it alive. So many people don't even know what they don't know. Even worse they don't know themselves and their limitations.

 

[backlash]

I remember that story.
I also remember a story about a couple that moved to a cabin in Montana. During the winter a guy got to wondering about them and asked some snowmobilers to check when they were close.
The woman and dog were frozen to death and the man was barely alive.
They didn't plan on staying the winter but got trapped by a blizzard.
I might have read about it on the old site we used to read.

 

[Terri9630]

Give most Texans 3 years at best, and they are gone.

Hey!! I'm a Texan and I'm moving to the mountains, by way of the NM desert.... I can survive up there just fine, just as long as I don't run out of life's most necessary items. Dr Pepper and beef. The one store in the 'thinks its a town' that's closest to us has already been informed that they will need to stock much more once I move up there next month. The beef will be covered once the barn is built.

 

[Weedygarden]

Hey!! I'm a Texan and I'm moving to the mountains, by way of the NM desert.... I can survive up there just fine, just as long as I don't run out of life's most necessary items. Dr Pepper and beef. The one store in the 'thinks its a town' that's closest to us has already been informed that they will need to stock much more once I move up there next month. The beef will be covered once the barn is built.

Terri, you are probably a little more seasoned than many others. My guess is that you and your family will do fine.

Year ago some fool came to Alaska and moved into the bush to live the mountain man life. He died and a book and movie portraying him as a hero came out. He went into the woods with few skills and little sense and got himself killed. Tourists still hike into his bus to see where he died.

I saw the movie. This young man had a pretty messed up family. He was foolish, but he was trying to make sense of his life, especially his messed up and wealthy family.

 

[Caribou]

Terri, you are probably a little more seasoned than many others. My guess is that you and your family will do fine.

I saw the movie. This young man had a pretty messed up family. He was foolish, but he was trying to make sense of his life, especially his messed up and wealthy family.

The movie tried to portray him in a good light. Fine, don't speak ill of the dead. If I'd been the director it would have been a different movie. My friends pretty much feel the same. Enough of the locals get in over their heads without importing stupidity.

 

[lonewolf]

we don't have any mountains in England, there is one in Scotland and one in Wales but none in England.

 

[lonewolf]

we have people who move from the city, as soon as they move in they complain about everything, the church bells, the tractors holding up their commute back to the city, the cockerel crowing at dawn, the cows urinating in the field(I kid you not), no street lights, no pavements/side walks, no "coffee to go", no MacDonalds/KFC, the list is endless.
they usually last about 6 months then move back to the city.
you can see why I don't think city people could survive in the countryside post SHTF.

 

[Meerkat]

we don't have any mountains in England, there is one in Scotland and one in Wales but none in England.

According to The Kinks you also don't have an England now. Don't feel bad America is gone too so enjoy whats left.

 

[backlash]

we have people who move from the city, as soon as they move in they complain about everything, the church bells, the tractors holding up their commute back to the city, the cockerel crowing at dawn, the cows urinating in the field(I kid you not), no street lights, no pavements/side walks, no "coffee to go", no MacDonalds/KFC, the list is endless.
they usually last about 6 months then move back to the city.
you can see why I don't think city people could survive in the countryside post SHTF.

We have the same problem here except it's people moving from one place then trying to turn the new place into the same as the one they hated and left.
The problem is most don't give up and move back to California.

 

[viking]

When my wife, son and I lived in Colorado we were in the Denver area then we bought a home in the mountains at the 8,100 foot level, it took us about a year to really get used to living there, sinus infections were really hell as one time my ears cleared just as we were clearing the front range, I about drove off the road. When I first started fishing in the lakes above 10,000 feet I once got altitude sickness, a horrible headache that no headache medicine would help, but after a few times more parking at 12,950 feet and hiking down nearly 1,000 feet to the lake, I really began to enjoy the altitude and often hiked and hunted around the Tincup area at over 13,000 feet, once we got adjusted to going to those altitudes, it became almost addictive as we always felt great up there. The thing is, after you spend a lot of time at the higher altitudes, you gain a lot of extra red blood cells in your system. There was always stories we would hear of first timers that stepped out of their vehicles at the tops of some of the high mountain passes and passing out. Over the years that we lived in Colorado we often drove on the highest auto road in the USA, Mount Evans, it was over 14,000 feet and even the cars don't do too well up there. A couple of lakes that I fished at were on the way up to the top of Mount Evans. The road to that mountain starts across from Idaho Springs off of I-70, not that far from Denver.

 

[Weedygarden]

The movie tried to portray him in a good light. Fine, don't speak ill of the dead. If I'd been the director it would have been a different movie. My friends pretty much feel the same. Enough of the locals get in over their heads without importing stupidity.

There is something about this story that many people were really fascinated in. The book sold so many copies that it has little to no resale value. I have found it more than once in boxes of books for my book resale business.
There was a book written by one of his sisters. The siblings made a trip to the bus where he lived and died. There are many pretty messed up people in this world, parents and their children.

https://www.amazon.com/Wild-Truth-Carine-McCandless/dp/0062325159

"The spellbinding story of Chris McCandless, who gave away his savings, hitchhiked to Alaska, walked into the wilderness alone, and starved to death in 1992, fascinated not just New York Times bestselling author Jon Krakauer, but also the rest of the nation. Krakauer's book,Into the Wild, became an international bestseller, translated into thirty-one languages, and Sean Penn's inspirational film by the same name further skyrocketed Chris McCandless to global fame. But the real story of Chris’s life and his journey has not yet been told - until now. The missing pieces are finally revealed in The Wild Truth, written by Carine McCandless, Chris's beloved and trusted sister. Featured in both the book and film, Carine has wrestled for more than twenty years with the legacy of her brother's journey to self-discovery, and now tells her own story while filling in the blanks of his. Carine was Chris's best friend, the person with whom he had the closest bond, and who witnessed firsthand the dysfunctional and violent family dynamic that made Chris willing to embrace the harsh wilderness of Alaska. Growing up in the same troubled household, Carine speaks candidly about the deeper reality of life in the McCandless family. In the many years since the tragedy of Chris's death, Carine has searched for some kind of redemption. In this touching and deeply personal memoir, she reveals how she has learned that real redemption can only come from speaking the truth."

 

[lonewolf]

shows just what will happen to city people if they don't know what their doing.

 

[Spikedriver]

shows just what will happen to city people if they don't know what their doing.

What will happen to anybody who doesn't have knowledge of the environment they're entering...I'm a flatlander, and once you get me to the mountains I'm gonna struggle. I've worked - hard - at 9000 feet, and it's no picnic. But I got to go back to a hotel with fresh sheets and I ate restaurant food and I didn't have to do anything but work from 6am to 6pm. The rest of life was provided for. I didn't have to do anything else.
Put me in the swamp and I'll be useless - I've never spent time in one. I can handle northern forests, but I don't know the desert well. Knowledge is the first thing to have. Without it all the gear in the world is useless...

 

[lonewolf]

i'm a woodlander and moorland person myself.

 

[Weedygarden]

My real preference for living is the prairie. I grew up as a child on the prairies, and I used to spend time wandering around, looking for wildflowers and wildlife. The wind is always a challenge on the prairie.

 

[Spikedriver]

My real preference for living is the prairie. I grew up as a child on the prairies, and I used to spend time wandering around, looking for wildflowers and wildlife. The wind is always a challenge on the prairie.

Yes it is, and with it comes the dust and dirt...and there is little relief from the sun. I grew up on the farmlands too...

 

[hiwall]

My preference is high desert (3000 to 5000 ft). I love the desert. Our mountain place is fine but I do miss the high desert.

 

[Caribou]

It's the ocean, shore, and rainforest for me.

 

[Sourdough]

My preference is Lake Clark, on the Alaska Peninsula. Or even a bit south to Wide Bay.

 

[backlash]

It's the ocean, shore, and rainforest for me.

I'm with Caribou. The coastal areas would be my prefered habitat. It's not perfect but I am pretty sure I could survive there.
During a Navy survival class the beach was an easy place to get food. When we were moved to the high desert everyone went hungry for the 5 days we were there.
We were confined to a small area and they had classes there almost every week so anything that could be eat had been eat.
The Lewis and Clark expedition almost starved to death during the winter near Astoria, Oregon. If the natives had not helped them they would have died, so even the beach is not always a picnic.

 

[hiwall]

The trouble with being on the coast in most places in the USA after end times is the many other people who would be there with you. Otherwise I agree that an area like the Oregon coast would be a great place and pretty besides.

 

[SheepDog]

Coastal areas are places where mankind has always been drawn to. There are water sources and salt - a whole ocean of salt.
The West coast is problematic due to tidal waves (tsunamis), earth quakes and storms. I grew up in Western Washington and learned to camp and back pack in everything from the coastal beaches to the rain forests, the high alpine zones above the tree line and the semi-arid zones in Eastern Washington. I can find food and water in all those places. I have not really experienced the high deserts of Wyoming or the rest of the Southwest but have studied enough to know how to cope and where to look for water and food. I think it would be difficult for me to survive in those places as a resident but lasting a few weeks or a month while traveling through is something I am sure I could do.

 

[Spikedriver]

^^^ Pretty much the entire East coast can be problematic too...hurricanes suck. And the Pacific Northwest is too damn wet. I really think, realistically, the best places to be would be like the Missouri Ozarks - plentiful clean water, abundant rainfall for growing, plentiful resources, fish, and wildlife, and winters are not overly long and harsh, although it can get quite cold. I would imagine there are places in the Appalachian mountains that are similar. Once you get much West of Omaha, rainfall can get scarce. The Rockies have a lot of resources but aren't good for crops, even if you can find decent soil. I know there's places in East Washington that would fit the bill. TBH, North Minnesota would be great, but winter would be a killer.

 

[Amish Heart]

I'm a desert rat and do well in it, but don't like it much. I prefer the prairie and farmlands. Not the mountains, and even though I live in over 5000 ft elevation, I wouldn't want to go any higher.

 

[VThillman]

we don't have any mountains in England, there is one in Scotland and one in Wales but none in England.

Oceanic islands that are not volcanic or pre-historically so tend to be short on mountains, eh? (sorry)

 

[The Innkeeper]

True story .... I have an acquaintance who years ago loaded up his taxi with camping gear, along with a mastiff and a goat and headed to Alaska to squat and carve out a remote homestead for himself. The mastiff was for company and protection and the goat for milk (apparently the goat would just mature and start giving milk ... but this isn’t time for a biology lesson). He picked a spot, settled in and began to set up house. Winter found him camping in a roadside picnic shelter using the stove for warmth and cooking. He d**n near froze and starved to death. Oh ... and the mastiff ate the goat. By Spring he was home driving taxi again. A miracle that he made it through the winter. If he hadn’t been rescued at the picnic shelter he would have died there. It wasn’t as easy or romantic as he thought torun off and live in the woods