Saying no to unprepared families

[Silent Bob]

Moe answering the thread on deer...more jokingly, but really I have my heart in hunting in Texas, other than going to my wife's coworkers home to take out the feral hogs that are in his field and also to sight my scopes on moving targets. No offense all, but before I made Texas home, I lived in upstate New York as a teenager, my dad and aunt taught me to hunt with an old 30-06 with iron sights. Now don't get me wrong, I do enjoy my deer meat, and where my dad retired after the Army, they even had white albino deer with the devil eyes. Dad took one down in the old Army Depot in Seneca County. My aunt who is 12 years younger than my dad, sole survivor of 5 boys and one baby sister (my last uncle just passed two weeks ago), lives with her husband in the Adirondack Mountains. She is true Mountain Woman here, road horses up in the back-country, kayaked you name it and for most of her life, has not bought much store bought meat, except once in some ground beef. My wife is from North Dakota and after my jump incident where I pretty much was boarded out and retrained, I spent some years in North Dakota. I thought I loved hunting in New York, but nothing like corn fed deer, just walking right up into an open snow covered farmer field and not even breaking a sweat. My brother in law lives in Montana, elk, deer, moose, antelope, he's about taken any of them down either by rifle or bow. My real hunting is in Montana now.

My point, well I just can't shoot Bambi here in Texas, no matter how starved I get to my mouth watering, they taste to much like the mesquite and also the deer in Texas remind me of the miniature deer I saw in my tour in England. Sorry all, I guess I will save them for all of you if SHTF (Jim you bag, one for me) and head to Colorado, where I don't mind thumbing the auto-selector and hitting one between the eyes. lol

We plan to put a sign up that tells them to move on...pretty much stated plainly in my ROE. I know not very neighborly and Christian, Jim, but just can't chance it...once they get inside the second wire, I have to treat them like they have hostile intent.

 

[DrHenley]

My wife has hit two and I've had two close calls. One buck got hit by another car in the left lane just ahead of me. The deer sailed through the air across my path, sailed over the shoulder and landed in the ditch at the bottom of the shoulder. The next day I found an antler stuck in the air dam. I still haven't figured out how that happened!

 

[nubria]

Those deer got my respect as i now only carry insurance on the other person. I got bell whistles but they not pay any attention. I start back using only hand tools as i believe they will turn out the power on us. Figure I better get into half decent shape it will be all we have to work with. Stock up on picks, hoes. shovels. post hole diggers, double blade ax. rakes.

 

[Potter County Man]

Bugging out of the entire state of Texas is going to be next to impossible unless you're already near the border... And I don't see what the state really matters. We've got rolling hills, woods, rivers and lakes too... I feel pretty good about being in Tx. Also pretty much never have to worry about harsh winters and snow, crop failure from cold, etc. It just gets nasty hot but that's workable. I like how easy it has been to get all my weapons as well.

The farms around our BoL should be fairly self-sufficient, which will reduce the likelihood of our neighbors turning to raiding. Horses and cattle are in abundant supply if you know where to look, and my wife and I do. Not planning on stealing any obviously, but if someone leaves their stuff behind, it becomes fair game after a certain point. Put scavenged food and water out for your pets and see if they eat it or leave it alone after a few nibbles. If your hungry dog/cat rejects your find, it's probably spoiled or poisoned.

You are absolutely right about not being able to bug out of the whole state of Texas - but my other point would be if you can see it from the air, it probably isn't safe - from the standpoint of another world war and a invading country coming here to take us over.

If I was from somewhere else and I wanted to get in - the first two ways I would do it would be either from Mexico - where no one cares or Canada - either across the north pole or through Alaska.

From what I understand there is some mountains north of El Paso...

The other point is - wasting food.

I can see that you have never been homeless and you have never had to do without.
If you had to live like that then you would understand that you don't throw out hotdogs or bologna just because it turned green and you don't throw out bread - just because it has mold on it and you don't throw out food just because it looks or smells funny!

I can remember keeping my food in a small spring of running water, and drinking milk even when it was 90* outside and buying ice when I could afford it and eating what ever I could find - even if it was roadkill - just to get a little meat inside of me.

Maybe this is one of the things that makes me so hard to understand - some people calls it being mean or rude or unfeeling.
If the world comes to an end and everybody is looking for handouts - you can bet your bottom dollar that you aren't going to find any food in a store and the people that does not have food will eat anything they can catch or steal.

I never stole, not even food!
I picked things in the woods such as Princess Pine - for $.17 cents a pound and then carried it - sometimes more then a mile and then paid someone to haul it for me and then paid for the supplies to pick more - just so I could afford a little propane and some ice and some milk and some food. If you picked for 10 hours in a really good patch - you could pick 100 lbs in one day!

The problem is - if something bad happens - there won't even be those kinds of jobs and there won't be any money and there won't be any stores to buy food in!

One of the things I hate the most is these Moonshiner and Ginseng pickers and gold hunters that makes you think all you have to do is move there and pick it up off the ground and turn it in for big money! That kind of stuff just doesn't happen in the real world!

 

[Potter County Man]

My wife has hit two and I've had two close calls. One buck got hit by another car in the left lane just ahead of me. The deer sailed through the air across my path, sailed over the shoulder and landed in the ditch at the bottom of the shoulder. The next day I found an antler stuck in the air dam. I still haven't figured out how that happened!

And you didn't go back and pick up the deer and eat it?

 

[nubria]

I was born in a little place called Davis Creek W Va. Youngest of six kids my father died two years later. I started school in a one room school house. they didn't hand out free breakfast or lunch. Every thing i had was hand me downs Shoes with cardboard cut outs because there were holes in the bottom. Pinto beans was our basic meal I even carried them smashed up on two pieces of white bread for lunch. Tough time has been around for ever there going to get tougher very soon. Time we all put on our big boy pants cause its going to get real nasty.

 

[Gazrok]

You wouldn't catch me dead in Texas, California, Iowa, Nebraska, North or South Dakota, Nevada, Illinois, Ohio, South Carolina, Florida or Louisiana...

Plenty of rural areas in all of them. What kind of range do you think modern folks will have when they run out of gas? Being even a few miles into the country is going to mean you aren't going to be too harassed, especially if nothing of much interest near you.

 

[nubria]

Coming to the country doesn't mean your home free. If people don't know you your a outsider i don't think they'll greet you with open arms. How much can you carry or pack in a car. You need to find a friend where your headed Maybe store supplies at there place God only knows how long its going to last. Two people are better than one we all got to sleep so you can be a Plus in that way by one sleeps as the other watches.

 

[Brent S]

2 Thessalonians 10-13: Don’t you remember the rule we had when we lived with you? “If you don’t work, you don’t eat.” And now we’re getting reports that a bunch of lazy good-for-nothings are taking advantage of you. This must not be tolerated. We command them to get to work immediately—no excuses, no arguments—and earn their own keep.

My son and I have been watching the show "Colony" where they are faced with the same dilemma repeatedly. Here's the thing...they have to make trips to gather river water and oranges (which grow nearby) They also use a lot of wood, and they are running low. The first time some people came up begging for food and water, I would have told them: "Go get some water from the river and we'll give you some filtered water. Go gather some oranges and we'll give you some rice and beans. Go gather some wood, etc."

In other words, put them to work! Find something that they can do for you in exchange for the food.

Anyone healthy enough to make it to your door is healthy enough to do something useful.

I really like your post. I agree, I don't think I would make someone go hungry, but I have lots of chores I do to provide my preps. I can always find something for someone to help with. I wish our welfare system would come up with a similar idea. Even if you are old and out of shape, you could do something. I'm not a big fan of rewarding people for doing nothing. I can't tell you how many days I don't feel like getting up at 3:40am and going to work, but I do. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not heartless and realize sometimes people need help, I jus don't think it's a good idea to let them make a career of it.

 

[Brent S]

I'm a big fan of the work in exchange for food idea, but yeah, the security concern is there, so in a SHTF situation, you'll have to establish some basic measures to ensure they are sincere and don't slit your throat while you sleep.

No doubt, you have to consider being careful what kind of work you could offer as you don't want to expose your supplies and any security you have to strangers.

 

[Brent S]

Those deer got my respect as i now only carry insurance on the other person. I got bell whistles but they not pay any attention. I start back using only hand tools as i believe they will turn out the power on us. Figure I better get into half decent shape it will be all we have to work with. Stock up on picks, hoes. shovels. post hole diggers, double blade ax. rakes.

I started replacing all my old hand tools this year too. It's great having a tiller, but you need a backup if no gas is available, as well as saws, axes etc.

 

[Uncle Albert]

The lack of trust is one of the biggest reasons why we as Preppers, Survivalists or whatever you want to label us is the reason we need to meet now. We need to get to know each other because the more support you have the more likely you will survive. The round-ups are great ideas but local should try and reach out too. When the SHTF we will need radios to stay in contact because of the great distances but there will be experiences to be shared and that will be extremely important.
I like the common scense being shared in this thread.

 

[nubria]

I told people that know me if the SHTF you come by my house. You need to be naked and do'in the Hokey Pokee turn around. Show me you got no gun tape on your back. People will kill for food. Brent you may also want grain grinder , meat grinder. I got a coffee grinder fit over wide mouth mason jar.

 

[Uncle Albert]

Tell me honestly, what kind of drugs are you on nubria? It's obvious that you're not a student of History, or even an observer of human behavior. So you are either pulling our legs or you are proprietor of a medicinal pot shop. I notice that you are from Hemphill, TX.

 

[nubria]

It all about the next day. You make a choice the right one you see another day. The wrong one who know what you'll see. You ever walk the streets of Bombay seen the spider people.? That the ones they deform at a early age. Gouge out a eye, break a arm and don't reset it. When they finish it looks like a mass of flesh banging a tin cup. They call that a great living sat on a corner in the morning pick up around dark fed if their lucky. So asking someone to do a little dance ain't bad. They don't have to stop their choice.

 

[Uncle Albert]

I know what you're talking about and I just can't undestand why man has to committ such haneous crimes against his fellow humans. I am a Vietnam Vet and I saw stuff going on, not only by the warring factions but our military against civilitions. The leadership turned a blind eye to it and whistleblowers who were not in combat positions were set to meet Charlie. But the bottom line is my friend, where are you? Mentally. Let's talk right from wrong. My, opinion? It's a very gray area.

 

[Uncle Albert]

I know what you're talking about and I just can't undestand why man has to committ such haneous crimes against his fellow humans. I am a Vietnam Vet and I saw stuff going on, not only by the warring factions but our military against civilitions. The leadership turned a blind eye to it and whistleblowers who were not in combat positions were set to meet Charlie. But the bottom line is my friend, where are you? Mentally. Let's talk right from wrong. My, opinion? It's a very gray area.

 

[nubria]

I owe it to my wife to provide the best possible chance of our survival. My tactics may be some what harsh, but people can change when they have nothing. as they laugh at Noah about the ark. They refuse to put away for their future, Its not going to happen In a country this great. They live in denial as the time draw near they will die. I refuse to be their victim they may kill me but not with out a fight.

 

[Maverick]

A year if not sooner after the SHTF wildlife strays and pets will become scarce unless one is in the deep woods, you will have a group of traveling hunters taking game to feed their own communities or use the meat for bartering and or control, don't rely on the local population of game to feed the family, note: when one hunts in alaska that shot you just fired is a dinner bell to the grizzly, hungry people are no different then the grizzly! learn to hunt without a firearm.

 

[nubria]

I got a silent cat 177 caliber rifle for small game. Live traps for small game. I'm stocked and ready for whats to come. Also have fishing yoyo. I do grow most of my food. Have a fresh water lake in front. In the forest away from most. Hope to be left alone but not likely. I'm ready on that end also.

 

[Clyde]

After reading One Second After and Lights Out, I've been wondering how I'd handle visitors from inside and outside the neighborhood who come to everyone's door with outstretched hands after a grid down situation.

I'd have no problem turning away able-bodied adults and backing it up with my 870 if need be. And I know that once you give a can of food to even a family of good, deserving people, either that family will be back every day thereafter, or worse yet, word is going to get around you have more. Remember the American Blackout youtube movie? Still, I can't stand to see hungry kids.

We're very close with two or three neighbors and would be happy to share with them. Problem is, none of them are preppers. I think they know I am because of old Y2K preps and that I'm the only one on the block with a generator.

Maybe I just tell everyone we got nothing. Or maybe I display a small decoy stash of food, so that's all anyone thinks we have.

It might be different if we lived in a protected community with other like-minded, armed families where we could afford to give an occasional gift of charity food or water, but we're one family in the suburbs, and not likely to bug out.

Anybody ever given this some thought? What did you come up with?

2 Thessalonians 3: 10-13: Don’t you remember the rule we had when we lived with you? “If you don’t work, you don’t eat.” And now we’re getting reports that a bunch of lazy good-for-nothings are taking advantage of you. This must not be tolerated. We command them to get to work immediately—no excuses, no arguments—and earn their own keep.

I am of the mindset that if you do NOT do what you need to, to care and provide for you and your family then tough crap!
I know this may cause me to sound like some evil over lord, but I, like nearly all others, hate to see kids go hungry. I also know people will use kids to get what they need. I saw this when I was in china this past summer, or the movie Slum Dog Millionaire.

I also recall a children's story about preparing yourself that had an ant and a grasshopper as the main characters.

However, in this day and age so many people will not accept responsibility for their own actions nor will do what they need to as they believe the government will take care of them.

 

[nubria]

I am of the mindset that if you do NOT do what you need to to care and provide for you and your family then tough crap!
I know this may cause me to sound like some evil over lord, but I like nearly all others hate to see kids go hungry. I also know people will use kids to get what they need. I saw this when I was in china this past summer, or the movie Slum Dog Millionaire.

I also recall a children's story about preparing yourself that had an ant and a grasshopper as the main characters.

However, in this day and age so many people will not accept responsibility for their own actions nor will do what they need to as they believe the government will take care of them.

People listen to the propaganda that all is well. I know people with great deal of money that believe nothing can happen that will hurt them. Your right that people will use kid or what ever means they can muster. The worst case I see is the prison gate open wide the worst of the worst released upon a frighten public. Were lucky to live were we do. But The scavengers will come this way sooner or later. I do have a lust green forest around me. And a sniper suit to match. Maybe God will smile upon me.

 

[Uncle Albert]

Maverick, I believe you're right. So many people will stalk the wildlife that they will be depleated quickly. I'm thinking if things get really bad and I have to get out I'll relocate to the ocean. When the fish trollers stop raping the oceans we'll once again be able to harvest from the beaches because the fish will come back. As a child on the California coast I remember always being able to cast out a line and bring in good sized perch or whatever. Could do it all day.
One more thought, what's going to happen to all those oil rigs sitting out there when men stop tending them? Do they have an automatic shut off that won't fail over time? Scarey thought.

 

[nubria]

Maverick, I believe you're right. So many people will stalk the wildlife that they will be depleated quickly. I'm thinking if things get really bad and I have to get out I'll relocate to the ocean. When the fish trollers stop raping the oceans we'll once again be able to harvest from the beaches because the fish will come back. As a child on the California coast I remember always being able to cast out a line and bring in good sized perch or whatever. Could do it all day.
One more thought, what's going to happen to all those oil rigs sitting out there when men stop tending them? Do they have an automatic shut off that won't fail over time? Scarey thought.

The rate Japan pumping nuclear water into the Atlantic it may be a waste ocean before much longer. The dead zone grows everyday.

 

[Gazrok]

learn to hunt without a firearm

Fishing and killing domesticated livestock is relatively quiet....

 

[Maverick]

Fishing and killing domesticated livestock is relatively quiet....

That it is Hopefully folks that harvest live stock have learned to cure the meat or learn to eat a 100+lbs in a day, waste isn't a option

 

[Uncle Albert]

You guys are right, the pollution will continue in our oceans. Okay, plan B...I'm going to learn how to eat insects, bats and grub worms.

 

[nubria]

You guys are right, the pollution will continue in our oceans. Okay, plan B...I'm going to learn how to eat insects, bats and grub worms.

I eat fish from Toledo Bend only now. Can trust those companies .

 

[Warriorhealer22]

wow, if only the Indians were given this advice before feeding the Pilgrims!

 

[Brent S]

I am of the mindset that if you do NOT do what you need to to care and provide for you and your family then tough crap!
I know this may cause me to sound like some evil over lord, but I like nearly all others hate to see kids go hungry. I also know people will use kids to get what they need. I saw this when I was in china this past summer, or the movie Slum Dog Millionaire.

I also recall a children's story about preparing yourself that had an ant and a grasshopper as the main characters.

However, in this day and age so many people will not accept responsibility for their own actions nor will do what they need to as they believe the government will take care of them.

At work yesterday an attractive woman walked in with a baby in a carrier hooked on her arm. She went into a long elaborate story how she was trying to get back home but had no gas left in her car. I actually had no cash on me, so was no help. She went thru the building for probably 20 minutes, and I noticed her again when she left. I did notice she got into a new Nissan. I hope she really was just in a pinch, because using a baby to help your profits from begging is pretty low.