Setting up the Ideal homestead or retreat small community for even tougher times

[Sourdough]

So does anyone have a masterplan of how they will survive a multi month or multi year breakdown of goods and services?

YES, I know that many on this forum have a masterplan for long-term survival.

https://www.homesteadingforum.org/threads/extensive-caching-program.1812/#post-1080422

Sadly, it has no broad appeal. In-fact it is mostly a long list of deal killers for most preppers.

 

[UserNameTaken]

I have to catch up on prior posts, but first -

I think it might be beneficial to consider current events/crisis in our discussion and how building a community, or getting a handful of other like minded people from potentially disparet backgrounds together in our existing world. Though a full on shtf is also quite valid.

For example depending on how things shake out here in the next few months to several years, we could find ourselves with a somewhat non-functional government. We could encounter food supply and supply chain problems, not to mention affordability issues for needed products. Increased crime, civil unrest (probably urban) etc.. A "liberty garden" to supplement purchased food may be more realistic than a fully sustainable farm requiring years to build.
And how we can "vette" potential members of a community. Current reality is many rural properties are at risk of intrusion without ample manpower on site 24 hours to thwart burgulary, or worse. But you don't want to bring a thief or drama into your circle either. And it happens.

Maybe some discussion of numbers and how does one "age in place" on a more rural property, with or without additional help. My book series I hope to explore the age issue, the characters (so far) range from 15 to 68. One thing I found in our search for a homestead has been how to incorporate others, especially as I age. A bunch of geriatric patients aren't going to be much help to each other. Young blood is needed. But young people are building families, need more income than a small farm can offer. I'd like to hear your thoughts on how we mitigate those issues, as we will all face it one day.

@montanabill - I talk with Jayson Ross (not his real last name) who wrote Homestead online every so often. He's very supportive of other writers. In fact later in my series the two stories will (hopefully) interact a little. His group has a refinery, mine has Hoover Dam, a match made in heaven, or maybe hell. LOL That is his actual house outside Salt Lake used in the movie and series. Though it's staged for the filming of course. But he's a real prepper as well as an awesome writer. Doing stuff on his scale is financially beyond most of us, but having a place with 3 or 4 other couples or younger families can provide a generational aspect that benefits everyone.

More later.

 

[UserNameTaken]

Oh PS regarding my "masterplan" - yes, more or less, subject to change. We can self sustain for close to a year currently, not counting the "sustainment" around my waist. Beyond that things could get tricky. We are trying to grow a food garden, in three existing planters in the back yard. I'd hoped for more success, but scallions and a few small potatoes has been it. Our issue is we can hopefully supplement our food, but without co-op water it's not realistic to water haul.

I have tried every which way, but the fact is, without power and flowing water from the faucet the Colorado River valley is untenable. There is 80,000 people living in a 30 mile long valley that 200 years ago supported 400 indians, and they were smart enough to head to the high country for the summer. And there's plans for 15,000 more homes.

So like I say when the food, pets and neighbors run out we starve, if not before. So I need a better plan.

 

[Sourdough]

So does anyone have a masterplan of how they will survive a multi month or multi year breakdown of goods and services?

I don't want anyone to do a line item list of their current set up..

https://www.homesteadingforum.org/threads/extensive-caching-program.1812/#post-295598

 

[Magus]

The wife and I have been to Barrow many times. What a crap hole, full of welfare losers. Booze is banned, so many of them huff gasoline or spray paint, and people still smuggle booze in there. The few that do work are undependable and will quit without reason or notice.
What a great little community that was created by government handouts. Many times I was pressured to hire these people, I always refused.

Sounds like my home town.

 

[Magus]

Oh PS regarding my "masterplan" - yes, more or less, subject to change. We can self sustain for close to a year currently, not counting the "sustainment" around my waist. Beyond that things could get tricky. We are trying to grow a food garden, in three existing planters in the back yard. I'd hoped for more success, but scallions and a few small potatoes has been it. Our issue is we can hopefully supplement our food, but without co-op water it's not realistic to water haul.

I have tried every which way, but the fact is, without power and flowing water from the faucet the Colorado River valley is untenable. There is 80,000 people living in a 30 mile long valley that 200 years ago supported 400 indians, and they were smart enough to head to the high country for the summer. And there's plans for 15,000 more homes.

So like I say when the food, pets and neighbors run out we starve, if not before. So I need a better plan.

Come to Georgia, bring your guns, but forget Atlanta; its a cesspool. Good weather, stupid deer, BBQ everywhere in the summer, And then there's this:

5.39 percent
Georgia | #26 Overall The state has recently transitioned to a flat individual income tax and is gradually reducing the tax rate (currently 5.39 percent, scheduled to reach 4.99 percent by 2028), two positive developments in terms of tax competitiveness.

Jobs everywhere; I see signs all over!

 

[elkhound]

https://www.homesteadingforum.org/threads/extensive-caching-program.1812/#post-295598

https://www.homesteadingforum.org/threads/island-living-and-survival.18144/

 

[Haertig]

YES, I know that many on this forum have a masterplan for long-term survival.

https://www.homesteadingforum.org/threads/extensive-caching-program.1812/#post-1080422

That caching strategy is quite intriguing. Could I ask if you own the land your caches are on, or do you know the owner of the land, or do you use public land? That would seem to be a piece of the strategy that requires some thought (location/land ownership).

 

[Hardcalibres]

The thing is, having a lot of land would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, having a lot of money (gold, whatever) would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, having a large stockpile of emergency supplies would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, having many useful skills and knowledge/experience would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, having animal stock and vegetable gardens would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, living in the perfect climate/environment/location would be a benefit after society ends.
The thing is, belonging to a good survivalist group would be a benefit after society ends.

That is an OK list.....but a bit general and vague.

The thing is, most people only have one, maybe two (in the rare case), of these things.

Perhaps most people......but all survivalists know they are a tiny minority of the general population......so not being part of "most people" or even being a "rare case" is part of the survivalism thing.

So everyone is going to be "making do with what they have", no matter what.

Whoa ......suddenly we have jumped to "everyone"........no.....not by any means, everyone.......and by no stretch defined as "no matter what".

Those stretches from rare to never are part of denial that many with normalcy bias use to tell themselves and everyone else, there is no such thing as being prepared.

 

[lonewolf]

The thing is, at least this side of the pond, most preppers seem to make their prepping/survival plans too complicated, , they MUST have electricity at all costs and they must have technology, my needs are simple and so is my philosophy.

 

[Haertig]

Whoa ......suddenly we have jumped to "everyone"........no.....not by any means, everyone.......and by no stretch defined as "no matter what".

Some people have planned for and prepared for every contingency, bar none, and they will never have to "make do". Or so they believe. I don't agree with this thinking, but I acknowledge that it exists.

Those stretches from rare to never are part of denial that many with normalcy bias use to tell themselves and everyone else, there is not such thing as being prepared.

One can certainly be prepared. But they are never prepared for everything. It is not denial or a statement of "there is no such thing as preparedness" to acknowledge this. I think the denial comes into play when someone thinks they are prepared for everything. That is not a call to not prepare, that is a statement of the obvious.

 

[lonewolf]

I have never prepared for this or that event, over which we will have no control anyway, I prepare for what comes after which will be Societal Collapse and WROL.

 

[Tirediron]

I don't really think the end of "civilization" will be what most people are expecting, there is a large potential that things just grind to a halt, or the fake money system just becomes more exposed, (any financial type thing is based on consensus value, not real value) Skills and methods get lost, until a simple (to those who know) situation becomes dire. My bets are on something un foreseen causing almost everything electric/electronic based to stop functioning, that could really happen even if people think it can't. almost everything has electrical components.

 

[montanabill]

Lots of good comments and some very good references to past posts..

Caches are cool and in the right circumstance can work and be a lifesaver..
I had to pull some out of the woods when we left after a forest fire.. I buried in the big blue reclosable drums with the screw off tops...Luckily I placed them uphill from vehicle access so I was able to skid them out down hill. I put them in by transporting on a 4 wheeler but getting them out it had snowed so I just used the drums like a toboggan.

I also store in 55gal reclosable drums. #10 cans will rust..

Energy and growing conditions are important... Check out the local farmers market for what grows in your area...Here on the east slopes of the rocky mountains we have a thriving farmers market with all sorts of fruits and vegies..This is one reason I see my fantasy retreat close to a smaller town but removed from major cities.
Someplace that has sustainable irrigation for crops like a river or consistent ground water less than 20 ft deep..
For power hydro dams or even usable small streams have historically done work or generated power. Even on a small scale they are usable.
Where I am there are accessible coal seams and some have rail lines adjacent.

as far as rail lines after the crash check out the cool speeders people have built..even pedal powered.

Wood for heating and building is nice to have around...The state of montana has millions of acres of forest and after the last beetle kill many trees are well aged for construction or firewood.

As most of discussions go everyone has their ideas or their current place of habitation and anything else is unthinkable...This is one area I agree with "don't plan for scenarios but gain skills and assets".

This has been fun talking and if anyone wants to add something new and exciting or insight in how to deal with what is surely coming by all means pitch in..

A consideration is how to decide who you want to add to your undermanned group... If anyone has done rental management it teaches what a intricate thing that is.. Mainly I look for flexible, versatile loyal people. From the old hippie commune days they would have people showing up for free stuff and that was fine as long as they chopped firewood for four hours. Another qualifying thing I saw in a old movie was the aprentice who wanted knowledge was told to go out and dig a 3 foot by 3 foot by 3 foot hole in the ground....no explanation just do it....

Now I have to get busy with a hundred or so yogurt and cottage cheese containers getting them ready to grow starts for the coming year.....

Sleep peacefully and eat well..

 

[Magus]

I'm currently reinventing my plans. Storing more food and ammunition is on the top of the list,
Moving out of the Winnebago and getting it roadworthy is next after a few more modifications.

 

[UserNameTaken]

Regarding fires - anybody remember the Brian Head, UT fire about 10 years ago? Some guy in Cedar City had a cache that got exposed and burned by the fire. Oops...

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2017/11...illed-bunkers-hidden-under-make-shift-cabins/

 

[Mountain trapper]

We won't be having a community here on our homestead. We don't know anyone that we'd want here. Besides, everybody that we know already has their own land, homestead/ranch and family. Our kids live 400 miles away. The wife and I came to the realization that it will only be just the two of us. We're fine with that. We already have all the skills necessary to live off grid, plus all the tools and equipment. We have at least 2 years of propane on hand, 2 years of gasoline and diesel if we stretch it, and at least a year of food. We have way more than a lifetime supply of firewood for heat and cooking, or for building materials. Our only short coming would be winter hay for the livestock. This spring I'm going to put in about 20 acres of improved pasture and hay ground. That should produce about 60 ton of hay, depending on moisture.
I'm also looking in to buying some Scottish Highland cattle, and Idaho Pasture pigs. They both do well with foraging on brush so will need less hay.

 

[Sourdough]

That caching strategy is quite intriguing. Could I ask if you own the land your caches are on, or do you know the owner of the land, or do you use public land? That would seem to be a piece of the strategy that requires some thought (location/land ownership).

I have built (4) FOUR remote habitable survival homesteads in Alaska in the last 56 years. Several were fly-in only, but I was a commercial pilot and owned my airplanes. The specific property you inquired about was (16) Sixteen Acres surrounded by the (7) Seven million Acre Chugach National Forest. What was special about that property is it has a 30-foot waterfalls on that property.

I always selected properties remote or generally "DEEP" Remote. Always on pure fresh water, always with few (if any) humans, always they had over abundance of free food. It was of ultimate priority that I could never go hungry.

My favorite of them all was the cabin I built on "Majestic" Lake Clark forty-one years ago. It was actually my "small" hunting & fishing lodge.

When I moved to Alaska nearly all land "not" inside an existing park, was available from the Federal or Alaska government.

 

[Magus]

I may be forced to find a community, as much as I despise the thought.

 

[Haertig]

I have built (4) FOUR remote habitable survival homesteads in Alaska in the last 56 years. Several were fly-in only, but I was a commercial pilot and owned my airplanes. The specific property you inquired about was (16) Sixteen Acres surrounded by the (7) Seven million Acre Chugach National Forest. What was special about that property is it has a 30-foot waterfalls on that property.

I always selected properties remote or generally "DEEP" Remote. Always on pure fresh water, always with few (if any) humans, always they had over abundance of free food. It was of ultimate priority that I could never go hungry.

My favorite of them all was the cabin I built on "Majestic" Lake Clark forty-one years ago. It was actually my "small" hunting & fishing lodge.

When I moved to Alaska nearly all land "not" inside an existing park, was available from the Federal or Alaska government.

That is so cool. You live in a unique and pretty enviable situation.