Solar

[Warriorhealer22]

Only if you like being without power when the sun isn't up....
Kind of the point of the batteries (power when the sun isn't available)......

Yeah, I get it!

But the fact must be faced that they will go bad, isn't the average life span about 5 years? How long will spares last in storage and what's the best way to long term store them?

Does anyone here run their house off solar?

 

[TBob]

Yeah, I get it!

But the fact must be faced that they will go bad, isn't the average life span about 5 years? How long will spares last in storage and what's the best way to long term store them?

Does anyone here run their house off solar?

Not yet, but will be soon as the house is finished. Can't get electric company to come where I am. Solar and wind only.
Depends on the batteries...buy them dry and store them. Add the battery acid when you need them. Or use Edison batteries, they last forever. Plans available to make them online, or you can by them from a couple companies now producing them.

 

[Brent S]

Not yet, but will be soon as the house is finished. Can't get electric company to come where I am. Solar and wind only.
Depends on the batteries...buy them dry and store them. Add the battery acid when you need them. Or use Edison batteries, they last forever. Plans available to make them online, or you can by them from a couple companies now producing them.

Google NIFI batteries. Their the longest and best thing out so far. One thing about solar, even without batteries, is it works when youre awake and doing things, and at night most will get used to sleeping thru the night without all the modern distractions.

 

[TBob]

Tesla unveiled their home batteries on April 30th
7kWh for $3000 outright or lease for $1500 and $15/month for 15 yrs
10kWh for $3500 outright, not sure on lease.
They can be connected in series.
Not a bad option.

 

[Gazrok]

Some pretty pricey batteries though. And 10 year warranty.

At 7kWh, you'd need 4 of these to get close to the 31kWh average use. (and you'd be shy 3kWh)

http://money.cnn.com/2015/05/01/technology/tesla-home-battery-price/index.html

 

[Brent S]

Some pretty pricey batteries though. And 10 year warranty.

At 7kWh, you'd need 4 of these to get close to the 31kWh average use. (and you'd be shy 3kWh)

http://money.cnn.com/2015/05/01/technology/tesla-home-battery-price/index.html

Thanks for the link. I was hoping to see what type of battery it was. I'm still thinking the nifi battery is the best system. I had found a company in Gainesville fla that made them, but don't remember the price right now. My long term goal is to get the propane running for now, then slowly add solar and eventually a battery. Unfortunately this may take a few years. Mayby I should buy a lottery ticket every once in a while

 

[TBob]

My average use is much lower than 30kWh / day, only 14kWh / day now, in town, and with no chance of ever getting grid power back in where I am building, it isn't a bad deal, at least for me. and my use will be even less with all 12 volt then. Considering that other batteries need replacement every 5-7/8 years, and this is 15 yrs, it is cost effective. I could get by fine on 1, and live like a king with 2

Rarely do we have lights or TV on, the only thing powered full time is our internet and voip phone, and eco fridge. My service connection charge is more than my usage cost

 

[Brent S]

My average use is much lower than 30kWh / day, only 14kWh / day now, in town, and with no chance of ever getting grid power back in where I am building, it isn't a bad deal, at least for me. and my use will be even less with all 12 volt then. Considering that other batteries need replacement every 5-7/8 years, and this is 15 yrs, it is cost effective. I could get by fine on 1, and live like a king with 2

Rarely do we have lights or TV on, the only thing powered full time is our internet and voip phone, and eco fridge. My service connection charge is more than my usage cost

When I've stayed in a camper on a site without hookup, you just learn to conserve, both water and power. It would be the same way with your home with that system. It would just take getting used to. I could cut power in half without hurting at all. My wife, well, we won't go there .

 

[TBob]

When I've stayed in a camper on a site without hookup, you just learn to conserve, both water and power. It would be the same way with your home with that system. It would just take getting used to. I could cut power in half without hurting at all. My wife, well, we won't go there .

Oh...the wife thing...yeah, let's not go there. She really is trying but some things, well...she just can't do without, and those things are the energy hogs....curling iron, hair dryer.

 

[Gazrok]

My long term goal is to get the propane running for now, then slowly add solar and eventually a battery. Unfortunately this may take a few years. Mayby I should buy a lottery ticket every once in a while

Pretty much my goal as well. Propane is pretty reliable, doesn't degrade, and is relatively less expensive than other options. Used rationally, can really last a while too. I think solar is great for low drain items (like LED lighting) or for charging rechargeable items (like tools), or essentials like a well pump. But, I think the propane tank and generator would still be the best long term solution.

Hell, sometimes I wonder if it would be cheaper to use and keep refilling a propane tank, vs. paying the monthly electric rate. I should really do the math on it.

 

[Brent S]

Pretty much my goal as well. Propane is pretty reliable, doesn't degrade, and is relatively less expensive than other options. Used rationally, can really last a while too. I think solar is great for low drain items (like LED lighting) or for charging rechargeable items (like tools), or essentials like a well pump. But, I think the propane tank and generator would still be the best long term solution.

Hell, sometimes I wonder if it would be cheaper to use and keep refilling a propane tank, vs. paying the monthly electric rate. I should really do the math on it.

I've thought about slowly switching over the appliances to gas. My place is almost ten yrs old now so will need some new stuff before too long. I'm really kind of liking the LP on demand water heater. I don't know if it's really cheaper, but have always heard it is. (Although that was probably from people selling propane).

 

[Gazrok]

I hear it's cheaper to operate, but not cheaper for the initial purchase.

I did do the math, and at the current average price, it's still cheaper to get power from the electric company. Should they drastically raise rates, and if propane prices went down lower, it wouldn't take much to swing this the other way though.

One other thing I found...regular light bulbs are a major power expense. Just switching all of these to CFL bulbs (the spirally ones) made a big difference in our electric bill. If going the solar route, I'd recommend going even further and going to LEDs (that's the next step, we're phasing these in). As they use even less power.

The only downside of LED bulbs now though, is cost. Takes a while to get the payback for the initial cost. That's why we went to CFLs first. CFLs also last longer than the normal bulbs, and LEDs last even longer than CFLs.

Now, we use a lot of lights, and for a long period of time (with 5 people on different schedules, our house has folks home all the time and at all hours), so this was a much bigger impact than some might see. Still, highly recommended to get rid of all normal bulbs. Better for your bill, better for the environment.

If using solar though, you'll want to spend the extra dough on LED lights, because it will mean more available power for other items.

 

[Brent S]

I hear it's cheaper to operate, but not cheaper for the initial purchase.

I did do the math, and at the current average price, it's still cheaper to get power from the electric company. Should they drastically raise rates, and if propane prices went down lower, it wouldn't take much to swing this the other way though.

One other thing I found...regular light bulbs are a major power expense. Just switching all of these to CFL bulbs (the spirally ones) made a big difference in our electric bill. If going the solar route, I'd recommend going even further and going to LEDs (that's the next step, we're phasing these in). As they use even less power.

The only downside of LED bulbs now though, is cost. Takes a while to get the payback for the initial cost. That's why we went to CFLs first. CFLs also last longer than the normal bulbs, and LEDs last even longer than CFLs.

Now, we use a lot of lights, and for a long period of time (with 5 people on different schedules, our house has folks home all the time and at all hours), so this was a much bigger impact than some might see. Still, highly recommended to get rid of all normal bulbs. Better for your bill, better for the environment.

If using solar though, you'll want to spend the extra dough on LED lights, because it will mean more available power for other items.

Anytime I find LEDs on sale I snag them. There getting better, but are still pricey. I have about half switched to led now. I'm not in too big of a hurry though as I got a clearance deal on the spirals a couple years ago. They were the 100 w equivalent using 13 watts. I bought about 75 of them for something like a quarter each. I think I'm about 1/3 into them, so will keep using them till gone. For me the savings on the energy is good, but I mostly like the fact that LEDs last so long and I don't need to change them!.

 

[Gazrok]

That's a big plus for us, even on the spiral ones. My wife and I are...how to put this....a bit different. (Google on Debbie the Slider CNN). Let's just say we go through a lot of normal light bulbs, so really need longer lasting ones.

 

[cjsibley81]

What about the new things in solar power fixing to come down from that Tesla company. Those seem pretty reasonable and sound like they work great.

 

[Brent S]

What about the new things in solar power fixing to come down from that Tesla company. Those seem pretty reasonable and sound like they work great.

Even though this looks interesting, and is heading in the right direction, solar is still too expensive for the average American home. It is still cheaper to buy power than produce it here, but I think, or hope, that the day is comming. Now if you love remote, and power isn't available, then this is a good step in the right direction. Google NiFi batteries as well.

 

[Gazrok]

Brent's right on the money. Right now, it's simply cheaper to buy power. It's a pretty expensive investment with a long payback period right now....especially when the tech is growing so quickly. My advise is to wait on solar, unless you can lease it. Leasing it is actually a pretty cool idea (in states where you can).

 

[Cavemanjoe]

We use mainly propane and wood stoves for cooking as there is plenty firewood, no heating nessesary here.
I use a 12 V lighting system with battery and solar charging, also solar charging for phones, pad and laptop.
As we spend basicly all day outdoors depending on the weather on our covered terras and only sleep inside at night, so we don't use a lot of electric for lights. For the heavy work we still rely on the dsl.generator and we have a good supply of fuel stored. The solar panel is sufficient for our needs (4 people). We have a 3 month supply of canned foods and also rice, pasta and potato's from the garden with plenty fresh veggies. Spring with unlimited fresh water supply.
This will also be our barter means as every one needs water daily if SHTF scenario.

 

[Mountain trapper]

Brent's right on the money. Right now, it's simply cheaper to buy power. It's a pretty expensive investment with a long payback period right now....especially when the tech is growing so quickly. My advise is to wait on solar, unless you can lease it. Leasing it is actually a pretty cool idea (in states where you can).

I agree that solar is more expensive than high line power, although it is coming down in price some. Our new place is over 5 miles beyond the last power pole, so running utility power is no option for us, plus we don't want to be tied to the grid anyway. Hard to be independent when ya have a monthly power bill, which seems to keep going up. Our system will use wind and solar with a diesel backup. We'll buy off-road diesel and save on the fuel tax. My tractor and sawmill are also diesel so I'll have a large fuel tank installed for about a 6 - 8 month supply of fuel. I calculate that our solar/wind system will cost around $30k for all the components. Currently the Feds offer a 30% tax break for installing solar. That will help a lot to offset the cost. Some states offer tax breaks as well, not sure about my state yet. We'll use propane for cooking and heating water and wood for heating the house and the shop.

 

[Gazrok]

Should really look into propane as a power option though. It is definitely cheaper, and more reliable than solar, and with more longevity. I went into this thinking I'd go solar all the way, but after nearly a year of research into it, I came to the same conclusions Brent (above) did.

 

[bill harrell]

Good call

 

[Mountain trapper]

Should really look into propane as a power option though. It is definitely cheaper, and more reliable than solar, and with more longevity. I went into this thinking I'd go solar all the way, but after nearly a year of research into it, I came to the same conclusions Brent (above) did.

Solar is only as good as the storage capacity in your battery bank. And of course you have to have a backup generator with automatic switch gear. I'm going with a diesel backup (12kw), but my daughter is going with a propane/gasoline generator. I prefer diesel over propane because of longer engine life and lower maintenance and operating cost over time. Our place gets a lot of wind in the winter and spring when there is a lot of cloud cover. This will help offset the loss of solar.

 

[Gazrok]

I prefer diesel over propane because of longer engine life and lower maintenance and operating cost over time.

Just keep in mind that fuel degrades over time (so you'll need treatment solutions), vs. propane

 

[Mountain trapper]

Just keep in mind that fuel degrades over time (so you'll need treatment solutions), vs. propane

Exactly. I always keep a case of Sta-bul around. I just got a little gun shy of propane after paying $6 a gallon last winter during a "shortage". We will be using propane for cooking and heating water, but I can fill the tank in the summer at a lower price, at least until there is another manufactured shortage. My daughter and son-in-law are going solar with propane backup generator. They only need about 3.5 kw, so propane will be a perfect choice for them.

 

[Tommy H]

This may seem off the wall on first view but there were buses in South America that ran on an oxygen starved wood stove generating carbon monoxide to fuel the gasoline type engine. I wonder how you make such a CO generator and how you deliver it to the engine.

Tommy H