Underground shelters

[Texas Patriot]

But why go there? (shipping containers). There is other material that can be used that is cheaper and more secure, for underground shelters. For above ground, shipping containers are fine, but bury them, and they cause more problems than they solve.

My above list assumes a nuclear/biological threat bunker.

I figured the cost of using bricks and concrete. For the amount of square footage we need, the containers were actually the lesser expensive route to go.
The only reason we even decided to go underground was for the out of site out of view and because we have had several very high wind experiences that did not leave us too comfortable with the possibilities of being above ground.
We have played out a lot of different scenarios and concluded this was our best option.

 

[Brent S]

I figured the cost of using bricks and concrete. For the amount of square footage we need, the containers were actually the lesser expensive route to go.
The only reason we even decided to go underground was for the out of site out of view and because we have had several very high wind experiences that did not leave us too comfortable with the possibilities of being above ground.
We have played out a lot of different scenarios and concluded this was our best option.

I didn't do the math for anything larger, but for a smaller size the concrete and rebar was way less.

 

[Texas Patriot]

What size sq. footage are you figuring?

 

[Brent S]

What size sq. footage are you figuring?

I did an 8'x10' for right at 1000.00 so far in materials. I still need to make the doors, seal the inside and put up shelving, but have most of the materials for that allready.

 

[Texas Patriot]

Nice job! What is the primary purpose for this?

 

[Maverick]

If anyone does decide on an underground shelter make sure you also have several portable handheld marine based air horns, if for what ever reason someone gets trapped in an underground bunker use the air vents in the bunker and the air horn to alert of any distress, this should be first thing shown of any show and tell visitors and your permanent party, if you can get some halon extinguishers or an alternative such as the newer halocarbon based agents (providing your underground bunkers ventilation system is still intact)

 

[Brent S]

I wanted a cool place to store all the foods and wines I've made, that didn't need electricity. So the root cellar is the primary function, but the bonus of an emergency storm shelter is a big plus. You can look up my thread on the construction of it under underground shelter/root cellar. I posted picts all along so far, and will continue as I finish it, inside and out.

 

[Brent S]

If anyone does decide on an underground shelter make sure you also have several portable handheld marine based air horns, if for what ever reason someone gets trapped in an underground bunker use the air vents in the bunker and the air horn to alert of any distress, this should be first thing shown of any show and tell visitors and your permanent party, if you can get some halon extinguishers or an alternative such as the newer halocarbon based agents (providing your underground bunkers ventilation system is still intact)

Really good idea, safety is never overdone. I've been considering several options, such as tools to break out if the exit is closed, I'll have plenty of food and water, blankets to keep warm, etc. the horn, or two, will definately be on the list. I really wanted an escape tube, but just didn't have the funds for it. I really think two entry/exits would be wise if you can swing it.

 

[Gazrok]

I figured the cost of using bricks and concrete. For the amount of square footage we need, the containers were actually the lesser expensive route to go.

Did you factor in the cost of the men and equipment to transport the containers and place them precisely in place?

Simply put, these containers weren't made for it. (being underground). You're also going to need some welding equipment and skill to use these, and you'll have to buttress them heavily before putting any dirt around or on top of them.

Another option to look into is corrugated metal pipe (what many shelter companies use).

Just seen way too many caving in underground bunkers made from these containers. (like the ones pictured earlier in the thread)....

 

[Brent S]

Did you factor in the cost of the men and equipment to transport the containers and place them precisely in place?

Simply put, these containers weren't made for it. (being underground). You're also going to need some welding equipment and skill to use these, and you'll have to buttress them heavily before putting any dirt around or on top of them.

Another option to look into is corrugated metal pipe (what many shelter companies use).

Just seen way too many caving in underground bunkers made from these containers. (like the ones pictured earlier in the thread)....

I wish I could find some used corrugated pipe! I've seen lots of commercially made shelters from them, but they would make a great escape tube too.

 

[Gazrok]

Could check with local construction companies. Never know if they'll have some left after jobs, etc., that they could turn around for a profit.

 

[Brent S]

Could check with local construction companies. Never know if they'll have some left after jobs, etc., that they could turn around for a profit.

I kind of miss working around construction. You'd be amazed at what they throw away at the end of a job. My son brought me 4 large boxes of tek roofing screws, the really good ones. Theres about 400.00 worth of hardware they overestimated and were throwing in the dumpster! He is an electrician and brings me some stuff occasionally. Recently he told me about two pallets of extra brick that they dropped in the dumpster. They told him it was cheaper than taking the time to return it. I really hate waste!

 

[Texas Patriot]

Did you factor in the cost of the men and equipment to transport the containers and place them precisely in place?

Simply put, these containers weren't made for it. (being underground). You're also going to need some welding equipment and skill to use these, and you'll have to buttress them heavily before putting any dirt around or on top of them.

Another option to look into is corrugated metal pipe (what many shelter companies use).

Just seen way too many caving in underground bunkers made from these containers. (like the ones pictured earlier in the thread)....

I have been planning and researching this for many years now. When I do a project, it is not done without looking at every angle, option, and possibility.

 

[psalm 7]

I think the containers are a good idea for storage but not for a underground shelter . I am planning on a cement and block shelter dug into the side of a hill with drain lines under it to keep ground water from seeping . It will be alot smaller than a shipping container but will serve its purpose . If you have room a container could be placed in a trench that is angeled to drain down hill and you could not see it from a distance for storage or shelter .

 

[Brent S]

One of the good things about a container is it's pretty secure. I've seen padlock boxes on them that you can't get bolt cutters to, so there a good deterrent to thieves. If you build a pole barn over it to keep the sun off it may help with heat buildup too.

 

[Kenprep1979]

So, so much to consider in an underground shelter....

1.) Bringing in (and filtering) air. Getting out CO2.
2.) Waste Disposal (both human and just trash)
3.) Water storage
4.) Food storage
5.) If cooking or heating, how to vent smoke...(ironically, microwave may be best here)
6.) Medical supplies
7.) Blast door (and opening in, in case way is blocked by debris)
8.) Escape route (one way opening)
9.) Hiding the outside entry/exits
10.) Radiation shielding (metal, soil, concrete, etc.)
11.) Decontamination area
12.) Communications
13.) Above ground radiation detectors
14.) Room for people
15.) Plan for animals?
16.) Weapons and defenses (if found)
17.) Sanitation in general
18.) Entertainment options
19.) Lights, power options

just wanted to mention that when cooking you usually dont need ventilation because most range hoods actually are only for catching the steam/grease from your cooking and do not vent to the outside!

 

[Gazrok]

just wanted to mention that when cooking you usually dont need ventilation because most range hoods actually are only for catching the steam/grease from your cooking and do not vent to the outside!

True, but in an underground shelter, where oxygen is a factor...you don't want to be caught trying to figure out how to deal with smoke! Not to mention CO2 emissions.

 

[psalm 7]

Under ground its MRE's and junk food . Short term only unless its radioactive fallout you are hideing from . Watch a low budget movie called Aftermath I think Roni said he saw it too .

 

[Brent S]

True, but in an underground shelter, where oxygen is a factor...you don't want to be caught trying to figure out how to deal with smoke! Not to mention CO2 emissions.

I think underground is for storage only, just not sure if i want to live like a hobbit.

 

[Gazrok]

Talking more of a temporary shelter standpoint. Like for radiation to die down, etc. (or even a long, bad storm)

 

[Texas Patriot]

I agree Brent. I couldn't live like a Hobbit either.
Ours is for storage and a hide out if need be

 

[Maverick]

I don't know, some appeal to the hobbit home

 

[Graynomad]

I could easily live underground, as long as I have things to occupy me I don't much care what I'm living in. I often look at those missile silos etc that people buy and think, yeah I could live there.

There are serious security issues though, not sure I'd be as keen in a WROL scenario unless it's been very well thought through.

 

[Maverick]

The old silos would be very cool, I thought about buying one when they were cheap and very affordable years ago but that damn lingering question kept coming up 'are they still on a target list' the other problem, no resources around the silos, hunting for game, foraging would almost be impossible given the location of most.

 

[psalm 7]

Theres a cave on the Mnt side behind my home that native americans lived in there is a circle of rocks around it they carried out of it to get them out of thier way . Its just one large living room and because of how its situated the rain runs away from it and not into it . It use to be my Great Uncles land but since he died back in the 80's its changed hands and I nolonger go there . Great hunting and trapping there too .

 

[Maverick]

A Cave is my second BOL, we have a few around here.

 

[Gazrok]

Always loved the hobbit homes myself. As seen above, some folks have done some pretty amazing real life ones.

 

[Graynomad]

The old silos would be very cool, I thought about buying one when they were cheap and very affordable years ago but that damn lingering question kept coming up 'are they still on a target list' the other problem, no resources around the silos, hunting for game, foraging would almost be impossible given the location of most.

Good point about the target list

Also they seem to always be in the middle of an open plane without so much as a bush in sight let alone any wildlife.

Now a cave on the side of a mountain, that's real livin'

Have you guys seen our undeground houses in places like Coober Pedy

http://www.outback-australia-travel-secrets.com/coober-pedy-underground-homes.html

These are very cool (literally), just buy some land and start digging, or at least that's what you used to do, probably a 1000 building regs these days.

 

[Brent S]

Talking more of a temporary shelter standpoint. Like for radiation to die down, etc. (or even a long, bad storm)

I agree, in a real emergency you could hole up in it, just hope I never see that. My long term goal here is to build a small cabin on the back of the property and rent out the house for some income in retirement. I want a really good quality cabin, but small. The main thing I want is a concrete basement with a poured roof under the cabin. It will double the size of livable space, and give me a great storm shelter/bunker area. I'm planning to do it just like the shelter I'm finishing now. I think I will do about a 12' wide by 36' long cabin, and have allready started playing with layout ideas, but the basement will be the same size. I'm lucky with the property here being long and skinny, and theres a hill in the middle, so you can't see the back from the house, and vice a versa. Having some privacy is nice. I also have an incline Back there sloping down to a creek that's about 12' wide, which makes it perfect for a cabin in the woods.