- Joined
- Sep 4, 2020
- Messages
- 10,730
I have a private forest. The township wanted use govt money to put my stream in a culvert. I told them look elsewhere. That stream is alive with cray fish and frogs.
Ben
Ben
Watersheds, rivers, fish and more
- Thread starter elkhound
- Start date
Help Support Homesteading & Country Living Forum:
Prior to the St Lawrence Seaway crica 1959 there were free swimming Atlantic salmon. The Seaway damned up the river with the Robert Moses dam.
The “conservation”. effort was too keep restocking the lake locked salmon. Coho’s were introduced then.
The fishery grew and was thriving until early 90’s. There weren’t enough alewives able to get in to feed the fishery. NYS cut back on the restocking and as how any state does it,things got all out of balance and fishery declined
Same thing as the Klamath. The dam destruction is about protecting their political buddies. Partnering with the native tribes for the conservation, set the tribes to be the fall guys.
The destruction of the 3 dams over a 1 year period is going to screw up thing for 2 out of a 4 yr cycle. Sorry but thing are going to suck in 2028, 2032, 2036. Probably 2029, 2033, 2037 and so on.
The “conservation”. effort was too keep restocking the lake locked salmon. Coho’s were introduced then.
The fishery grew and was thriving until early 90’s. There weren’t enough alewives able to get in to feed the fishery. NYS cut back on the restocking and as how any state does it,things got all out of balance and fishery declined
Same thing as the Klamath. The dam destruction is about protecting their political buddies. Partnering with the native tribes for the conservation, set the tribes to be the fall guys.
The destruction of the 3 dams over a 1 year period is going to screw up thing for 2 out of a 4 yr cycle. Sorry but thing are going to suck in 2028, 2032, 2036. Probably 2029, 2033, 2037 and so on.
interesting read filled with historical writtings
pdf from 1966 report
https://www.afs-oc.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/AEHM223p305-315Dymond.pdf
Last appearance of the Lake
Ontario Salmon
It is impossible to associate a date with the
last native Salmon taken in Lake Ontario or its
tributaries. Available evidence suggests, however,
that some were in existence during the 1890’s but
disappeared towards the end of the decade. In
1890, one of the last Salmon was recorded: a
5 kg specimen taken on a fly rod below the first
dam on the Oswego River (Smith W., 1892). The
latest report is by Cobb (1900) who reported, “A
Salmon, weighing about 4 lbs. caught in 1899 in
gill-net set for whitefish in Lake Ontario”. This
fish was caught opposite the village of Wilson,
NY near Twelvemile Creek.
Summary
This is a summary of relevant information on
the history of the Lake Ontario Atlantic Salmon
from a 1966 report by Dymond and McKay and
review of studies since then. Discussed is the ori-
gin of Atlantic Salmon in Lake Ontario, condi-
tions for its success, life history, evidence for
early abundance, causes of decline and final
extirpation, and early reintroduction efforts.
pdf from 1966 report
https://www.afs-oc.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/AEHM223p305-315Dymond.pdf
Last appearance of the Lake
Ontario Salmon
It is impossible to associate a date with the
last native Salmon taken in Lake Ontario or its
tributaries. Available evidence suggests, however,
that some were in existence during the 1890’s but
disappeared towards the end of the decade. In
1890, one of the last Salmon was recorded: a
5 kg specimen taken on a fly rod below the first
dam on the Oswego River (Smith W., 1892). The
latest report is by Cobb (1900) who reported, “A
Salmon, weighing about 4 lbs. caught in 1899 in
gill-net set for whitefish in Lake Ontario”. This
fish was caught opposite the village of Wilson,
NY near Twelvemile Creek.
Summary
This is a summary of relevant information on
the history of the Lake Ontario Atlantic Salmon
from a 1966 report by Dymond and McKay and
review of studies since then. Discussed is the ori-
gin of Atlantic Salmon in Lake Ontario, condi-
tions for its success, life history, evidence for
early abundance, causes of decline and final
extirpation, and early reintroduction efforts.
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2013
- Messages
- 18,553
Advisories for Specific Fish Species
- Bass: The OEHHA advises against eating bass from the Los Angeles River due to high levels of mercury and other contaminants.
- Catfish: The OEHHA recommends eating catfish from the Los Angeles River in moderation, as they may contain low levels of contaminants.
- Other Fish: The OEHHA advises against eating other fish species from the Los Angeles River, such as carp and tilapia, due to high levels of contaminants.
from video description !!
Lino doesn’t usually eat the carp he catches from the LA River, but today is unusual.
Lino doesn’t usually eat the carp he catches from the LA River, but today is unusual.
If i was stuck in l.a. living have any little recreation area would be awesome..even if i couldnt eat the fish...its called recreational fishing and getting out in nature..even if its just a strip of concrete flood control turned into a strip of trees and trails with a few fish and a bit of wildlife...!! its better than concrete blank canal...!
By the late 80’s, the population had grown quite large. I used to fish in a derby every April. In the fall, we used to go snagging before the state stopped that.
By mid 2000’s it was a different story. I converted my boat to bass fishing but still had my down and outriggers.
Haven’t lived there in 12 years to know if the population is back up.
example of dealing with aging infrastructure and returning bits of area back to nature...as much as it can be in this setting...40 year old roads in this case.
feb-2020
The Elwha river was freed in 2011..this was filmed in 2021 for 10 year anniversary special. Things are improving slowly but surely. Glad steelhead is doing so great..salmon will too...pre dam numbers were 400,000 so thats the goal in my mind.
Last edited:
nov-2023
may 24,2024
In this video I give you a tour of the incredible Diglis Island Fish Pass and shed light on why it's so important for not only fish species like the Twaite Shad and Salmon but for the health of the UK's longest river, the river Severn!If you'd like to learn more about these projects and the great work being undertaken by the Unlocking The Severn project please visit www.unlockingthesevern.co.uk for more information.
In this video I give you a tour of the incredible Diglis Island Fish Pass and shed light on why it's so important for not only fish species like the Twaite Shad and Salmon but for the health of the UK's longest river, the river Severn!If you'd like to learn more about these projects and the great work being undertaken by the Unlocking The Severn project please visit www.unlockingthesevern.co.uk for more information.
UPDATE 6-3-24
This was a presentation at the May 22nd, 2024 Klamath Basin Monitoring Program (KBMP) Meeting in Yreka, CA by Ren Brownell from the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. Presentation Summary: Project status update covering dam removal and restoration activities.
This was a presentation at the May 22nd, 2024 Klamath Basin Monitoring Program (KBMP) Meeting in Yreka, CA by Ren Brownell from the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. Presentation Summary: Project status update covering dam removal and restoration activities.
VIDEO FROM May 21,2024 just uploaded on May 31,2024
California poppies (Eschscholzia californica), common fiddleneck (Amsinckia menziesii), and chick lupine (Lupinus microcarpus var densiflorus) are in their first bloom at the former Iron Gate and Copco Reservoirs.
These hardy species are native to California and thrive in disturbed soils. Their special powers have been recruited to help prevent not just soil erosion but to reduce the advance of undesirable plant species such as sheet grass and star thistle.
First spread by hand, successive generations will make their way to the river's edge helping secure soil while making way for shrubs and trees.
A fun fact here is these poppies are only in the seed mix dispersed by hand along the reservoir's former shoreline. Helicopter reseeding of the lower reaches didn't include the poppies.
Ongoing reseeding efforts are part of the Klamath River Renewal Project also known as the Lower Klamath Project (FERC No. 14083) being managed by the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. In addition to the removal of four hydroelectric dams the project involves massive restoration of the former reservoirs.
Restoration is managed by RES (Resource Environmental Solutions), headquartered out of Houston Texas and self-described as "the nation's largest ecological restoration company focused on restoring a resilient earth for a modern world."
California poppies (Eschscholzia californica), common fiddleneck (Amsinckia menziesii), and chick lupine (Lupinus microcarpus var densiflorus) are in their first bloom at the former Iron Gate and Copco Reservoirs.
These hardy species are native to California and thrive in disturbed soils. Their special powers have been recruited to help prevent not just soil erosion but to reduce the advance of undesirable plant species such as sheet grass and star thistle.
First spread by hand, successive generations will make their way to the river's edge helping secure soil while making way for shrubs and trees.
A fun fact here is these poppies are only in the seed mix dispersed by hand along the reservoir's former shoreline. Helicopter reseeding of the lower reaches didn't include the poppies.
Ongoing reseeding efforts are part of the Klamath River Renewal Project also known as the Lower Klamath Project (FERC No. 14083) being managed by the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. In addition to the removal of four hydroelectric dams the project involves massive restoration of the former reservoirs.
Restoration is managed by RES (Resource Environmental Solutions), headquartered out of Houston Texas and self-described as "the nation's largest ecological restoration company focused on restoring a resilient earth for a modern world."
june 3,2024 upload of video filmed may 17,2024
Harrison Ward is on record for being the original homesteader of 160 acres at the upper mouth of modern day Wards Canyon. Seven years later in 1889 his brother William homesteaded another 160 acres. This could be how Kikacéki, ancestral homeland to the Shasta Indian Nation and Modoc, came be to be known as Wards Canyon rather than Ward's Canyon
Making sense of the historic record is a challenge. Not only are misspellings common but fathers and mothers often had a son, daughter, or grandchild with same first names. The native population too had European names that came from popular culture as well as local association.
Kitty Ward, one of the last owners of record prior to purchase by the Siskiyou Electric Power and Light Company, offers such an example. Kitty was a twice widowed Shasta Indian and the sole owner of 240 acres referred to as Ward's Ranch.
Until recently, within the upper stretch of Wards Canyon sat the Copco No. 2 diversion dam, its conveyance system and small reservoir, as well as the 110 year old Copco No. 1 dam. There's little that remains of Copco No. 1, but it too is being carried away.
Dam removal and habitat restoration are part of the Lower Klamath Project being managed by the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. KRRC is the temporary landowner in care of the transition between an environment managed for hydroelectric generation to one more compatible for the survival of keystone fish species in danger of extinction
Harrison Ward is on record for being the original homesteader of 160 acres at the upper mouth of modern day Wards Canyon. Seven years later in 1889 his brother William homesteaded another 160 acres. This could be how Kikacéki, ancestral homeland to the Shasta Indian Nation and Modoc, came be to be known as Wards Canyon rather than Ward's Canyon
Making sense of the historic record is a challenge. Not only are misspellings common but fathers and mothers often had a son, daughter, or grandchild with same first names. The native population too had European names that came from popular culture as well as local association.
Kitty Ward, one of the last owners of record prior to purchase by the Siskiyou Electric Power and Light Company, offers such an example. Kitty was a twice widowed Shasta Indian and the sole owner of 240 acres referred to as Ward's Ranch.
Until recently, within the upper stretch of Wards Canyon sat the Copco No. 2 diversion dam, its conveyance system and small reservoir, as well as the 110 year old Copco No. 1 dam. There's little that remains of Copco No. 1, but it too is being carried away.
Dam removal and habitat restoration are part of the Lower Klamath Project being managed by the Klamath River Renewal Corporation. KRRC is the temporary landowner in care of the transition between an environment managed for hydroelectric generation to one more compatible for the survival of keystone fish species in danger of extinction
I will let you know when I live within 20 miles of the Klamath project in a couple years. My tenant whose native husband had a guide business both ocean and rivers after he retired from Prison system and passed in 2020. I know she was not in favor of what was happening.
One interesting thing too is around this river use to be way more oak trees according to historical records.According to Steven Edholm/skillcult who lives in northern California theres oaks dying all over..maybe its called sudden oak death or decline. He has shown its effect on his property.
I heard in one of these lectures they will be planting oak trees on this project.
In one of the longer videos the dam had biggest problem was designed by a fresh out of college engineer at age of 23 and it was his first project.The dam has had major troubles ever since it was built and starting on tear down it was found out they used railroad tracks for rebar in the things and concrete was mixed on site using local materials and it had/has a huge variation in strength to it.It goes to show the aging and improperly built older infrastructure we have and are facing in this country thats either going to be replaced,fixed if possible or torn down.In this case owners..the power company wasnt going to fix these dams for simple fact of cost so they were going to be torn down no matter what...so it really doesnt matter if folks were for or against this..it was going to happen...it just worked out the way it did and reason power company got rid of them to lower liability during tear down and cost etc.
The one drone video showing first things growing after seeding in late winter after draw down its interesting too.They collected native seed along river for 5 years to have enough seed to plant all the bare ground.
I heard in one of these lectures they will be planting oak trees on this project.
In one of the longer videos the dam had biggest problem was designed by a fresh out of college engineer at age of 23 and it was his first project.The dam has had major troubles ever since it was built and starting on tear down it was found out they used railroad tracks for rebar in the things and concrete was mixed on site using local materials and it had/has a huge variation in strength to it.It goes to show the aging and improperly built older infrastructure we have and are facing in this country thats either going to be replaced,fixed if possible or torn down.In this case owners..the power company wasnt going to fix these dams for simple fact of cost so they were going to be torn down no matter what...so it really doesnt matter if folks were for or against this..it was going to happen...it just worked out the way it did and reason power company got rid of them to lower liability during tear down and cost etc.
The one drone video showing first things growing after seeding in late winter after draw down its interesting too.They collected native seed along river for 5 years to have enough seed to plant all the bare ground.
This past fall after agreeing to stop all fishing for dam removal and decade of time for recovery native tribe got to harvest a few fish on the Elwha river.The coho has had better success than other salmon as of yet...all are gaining in numbers but coho is highest.So from over 7,000 annual fish return the Lower Elwha Klallam Tribe got to harvest 400 fish for their tribe !! Right on folks..its only going to get better as time passes on glad that the oldest members in tribe got to see first fish caught before they pass on this life!
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattl...lowing-elwha-river-a-first-since-dam-removal/
Tribe catches coho salmon on free-flowing Elwha River, a first since dam removals
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattl...lowing-elwha-river-a-first-since-dam-removal/
Certain oaks have been effected do to drought.
Live oaks have been breaking and blocking my road Mainly from the 2 mile mark and down. For the past couple years. None this year the second year of drought being over
Why not 2 mile to the 3 mile mark to my house? Because thats where the Black Oaks start. Above the 1000 ft elevation line. I have about 20 black oaks on my property, most notably a 7ft circumference one which translates to 300 yrs old near my house.
Live oaks have been breaking and blocking my road Mainly from the 2 mile mark and down. For the past couple years. None this year the second year of drought being over
Why not 2 mile to the 3 mile mark to my house? Because thats where the Black Oaks start. Above the 1000 ft elevation line. I have about 20 black oaks on my property, most notably a 7ft circumference one which translates to 300 yrs old near my house.
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2020
- Messages
- 10,730
this is not what guy is talking about in above video...see below.
june 2018
Walking through with a neighbor to identify and discuss Sudden Oak Death and look at tan oak trees infected w/ Phytopthera ramorum
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytophthora_ramorum
Phytophthora ramorum is the oomycete known to cause the disease Sudden Oak Death (SOD). The disease kills oak and other species of trees and has had devastating effects on the oak populations in California and Oregon, as well as being present in Europe. Symptoms include bleeding cankers on the tree's trunk and dieback of the foliage, in many cases leading to the death of the tree.
P. ramorum also infects a great number of other plant species, significantly woody ornamentals such as Rhododendron, Viburnum, and Pieris, causing foliar symptoms known as ramorum dieback or ramorum blight. Such plants can act as a source of inoculum for new infections, with the pathogen producing spores that can be transmitted by rainsplash and rainwater.
P. ramorum was first reported in 1995, and the origins of the pathogen are still unclear, but most evidence suggests it was introduced as an exotic species to Europe and North America in separate events.[1] Very few control mechanisms exist for the disease, and they rely upon early detection and proper disposal of infected plant material.
june 2018
Walking through with a neighbor to identify and discuss Sudden Oak Death and look at tan oak trees infected w/ Phytopthera ramorum
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytophthora_ramorum
Phytophthora ramorum is the oomycete known to cause the disease Sudden Oak Death (SOD). The disease kills oak and other species of trees and has had devastating effects on the oak populations in California and Oregon, as well as being present in Europe. Symptoms include bleeding cankers on the tree's trunk and dieback of the foliage, in many cases leading to the death of the tree.
P. ramorum also infects a great number of other plant species, significantly woody ornamentals such as Rhododendron, Viburnum, and Pieris, causing foliar symptoms known as ramorum dieback or ramorum blight. Such plants can act as a source of inoculum for new infections, with the pathogen producing spores that can be transmitted by rainsplash and rainwater.
P. ramorum was first reported in 1995, and the origins of the pathogen are still unclear, but most evidence suggests it was introduced as an exotic species to Europe and North America in separate events.[1] Very few control mechanisms exist for the disease, and they rely upon early detection and proper disposal of infected plant material.
Look at the background in June. I know they are fire tolerant/Notice the branch down to the ground and back up.
But wildfire is caused by climate change, dont you know. Cal fire Task force told me there was no recorded fire in this area while they were protecting my house during the last evac. Thats at least 100 years
We can’t believe everything we are being fed, especially by tree huggers. Mesofication is real, It’s just not what they saying
I was alway taught Birches, then beeches, Maples, then …. Especially back east were the video was from.
We have very high winds here. Most people that plant lose their trees. I am fortunate not to have a grand view from the house. But in my little hollow I do have citrus, plum and apple
You can’t believe everything put forth in a video. You have to be in tune with the surroundings.
Tan oak is a variety that is unfamiliar to me. I do know they aren’t around the western area of the Klamath. That area is Redwoods and conifer
to my understanding oaks were historically along all of kalamth and was used and gathered by natives up entire river system.
but who really knows...not arguing..just relaying conversations and things i read for awhile now...going way back.
as far as oaks in video from east...the guy told clear answer about oaks...young oaks cant take shade..so till a dominate tree falls you will see minimum oak regeneration...first you will see red maples etc. come in...and then as they die replaced by oaks..its natural succession of species.
theres is a disease in eastern oaks and it is attacking the root systems of oaks..i am at a loss for name though.
I always state what I have observed. I will be going by the Klamath next weekend. I camped there in the 70;s. i have been through there several times in the past couple years
I will retract if i am wrong.
I will retract if i am wrong.
when i say historical..i dont mean back to 1970's...i am talking 100's of years...like back to at least as this country was being settled it started changing.
heres your type forest too by the way.....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oak_savanna
https://www.opb.org/article/2023/03/20/klamath-river-dam-removal-restoration-billions-native-seeds/
Their planting design includes 96 different species: culturally significant plants like yampah and lomatium, important pollinator species like milkweed, and tens of thousands of oak trees. In total, RES aims to plant 250,000 trees and shrubs and 40,000 to 60,000 pounds of seed — enough to plant the reservoirs twice.
“We’re up to 13 billion seeds approximately,” says Gwen Santos, regulatory and ecology director for RES. “We’re trying to get to 17 [billion] to 19 billion.”
more oak references
While the Elwha originates in the relatively pristine ecosystem within Olympic National Park, the Klamath flows from a basin highly altered by irrigation and agriculture. The pressure from invasive species is greater here; the composition of native plants surrounding the reservoirs different. At Iron Gate, for example, most of the native upland trees are oaks and junipers. “An acorn is not going to fly 300 feet in the air like a red alder seed in the Elwha,” says Chenoweth. Sticky-seeded exotics like medusahead, on the other hand, will have no trouble finding their way to bare mud.
Billions of seeds
The revegetation of the Klamath River has been called the largest river restoration project in American history. Collecting, propagating and growing enough seeds and plants to populate the reservoir footprints — approximately 2,200 acres in all — is a staggering task. RES launched the effort in 2019, recruiting and training crews from area tribes to collect seed and prepare the ground, and partnering with commercial nurseries to propagate plants and seeds.Their planting design includes 96 different species: culturally significant plants like yampah and lomatium, important pollinator species like milkweed, and tens of thousands of oak trees. In total, RES aims to plant 250,000 trees and shrubs and 40,000 to 60,000 pounds of seed — enough to plant the reservoirs twice.
“We’re up to 13 billion seeds approximately,” says Gwen Santos, regulatory and ecology director for RES. “We’re trying to get to 17 [billion] to 19 billion.”
more oak references
While the Elwha originates in the relatively pristine ecosystem within Olympic National Park, the Klamath flows from a basin highly altered by irrigation and agriculture. The pressure from invasive species is greater here; the composition of native plants surrounding the reservoirs different. At Iron Gate, for example, most of the native upland trees are oaks and junipers. “An acorn is not going to fly 300 feet in the air like a red alder seed in the Elwha,” says Chenoweth. Sticky-seeded exotics like medusahead, on the other hand, will have no trouble finding their way to bare mud.
Yes and that map misses the coastline by 50 miles up north.
Makes me on an edge of ring around my current location
We are both right.
Makes me on an edge of ring around my current location
We are both right.
yes..when we speak about river..this being kalamth..it covers a huge amount of miles and various terrains and systems. i dont know if i can find it..and i could be wrong..but i think theres very old video from back in 30's of natives harvesting acorns on this river for food.
also of note..we are talking about area of dams being removed...so much farther up the river system.
