Bees

[user 7704]

I've been watching the lazy beekeeper tips by Michael Bush. I'm rather worried about the weight. Don't understand why you can't take the frames out and not move the whole deep. He says he uses mediums, but all the others say start with deep 10s. Oh well, I do plan on buying a silly because I'm placing them too far from the house to carry . Which is whtbi thought you could just take out the frames, do the work they need them replace them.

 

[TexasFreedom]

A couple of points. As I said, I really like Michael Bush's commentaries & methods. Not everything he does in artic-zone Nebraska will work in Texas, but many do.

Keep in mind, MB is 50-something+ (me too). He likes mediums and 8 frame vs deeps and 10 frame for 1 reason: he doesn't want back surgery. Me too. A full 10 frame deep can weigh 100 lbs. I think MB has a table showing various weights. Compare that to a 8 frame medium, closer to 50 lbs. So when you are lifting off a deep super, 'pop' goes your back.

And there is a second reason. Keep in mind, everyone recommends having 2 hives. It's really important. When (not if) one hive gets weak (lost their queen, need workers, etc), you can take a frame or two from your strong hive to 'help' them. And I can vouch for this, it's like when you drop toast 85% of the time it lands butter-side down. Same thing with hives, you will always want to put a medium frame in a deep box or vice versa. When all of them are mediums, you are 100% certain that any frame can fit anywhere else (they are all mediums).

BTW, I think you had a typo, 'buying a silly'? When you are adding/removing from hives, you normally do a full box. Taking out the honey one frame at a time is difficult (you'll realize all the reasons when you try). You take out the full body, you replace it with an empty body. Less stress on the bees and on you among many other reasons.

 

[user 7704]

Buying a dolly.. auto correct. Question. Can a nuc serve as a temp small hive in case I had to split before I could get another one. I'm finished asking questions tonight. I swear.

Oh, I will be 59 in 3 weeks. So I feel all the pain. Plus, I'm female and only weigh 118. I'm pretty strong though since I have to do all the gardening, fencing, etc .

Oh, I heard from the bee club in my county and they are rude compared to the adjoining county. Now I definitely know which one I want to join.

First impressions can make or break you

 

[TexasFreedom]

No problem, I'm usually up late.

A dolly will only help move it. You still have to LIFT the body off the hive and set it on the dolly. And a dolly won't help much here, a wheelbarrow might work better.

A nuc can work. If you have to split, you can do it a bunch of ways. Most nucs are 'deep', so that's not as helpful if you have medium frames. Now if you have a 2-body tall hive and need to split, each body can be separated. You'll need a 'top' and a 'bottom' for the second one, but a piece of cardboard or plywood would work in an emergency. You may need to shuffle frames to spread brood, but you have 2 bodies to arrange them in. You'll want to give each more space, but that's not needed immediately. I've got a few nuc bodies, but I've never used them.

PS: I just had a thought. Beekeeping is going to disappear. Think about the "Idiocracy" movie. People in coming generations will lack the intellect to be capable to keep bees. If they're eating tide pods now, they won't be able to do this... Very sad. Can you see with all the questions you have how complex this can be?

PPS: I just read a thread on another forum where a lady got bees, lost them the first winter. Second winter, lost a second hive. This is her third winter, and she's excited that her third colony is still alive. I don't want you to be doing what she has done, let's get it right on the first try.

 

[user 7704]

No problem, I'm usually up late.

A dolly will only help move it. You still have to LIFT the body off the hive and set it on the dolly. And a dolly won't help much here, a wheelbarrow might work better.

A nuc can work. If you have to split, you can do it a bunch of ways. Most nucs are 'deep', so that's not as helpful if you have medium frames. Now if you have a 2-body tall hive and need to split, each body can be separated. You'll need a 'top' and a 'bottom' for the second one, but a piece of cardboard or plywood would work in an emergency. You may need to shuffle frames to spread brood, but you have 2 bodies to arrange them in. You'll want to give each more space, but that's not needed immediately. I've got a few nuc bodies, but I've never used them.

PS: I just had a thought. Beekeeping is going to disappear. Think about the "Idiocracy" movie. People in coming generations will lack the intellect to be capable to keep bees. If they're eating tide pods now, they won't be able to do this... Very sad. Can you see with all the questions you have how complex this can be?

PPS: I just read a thread on another forum where a lady got bees, lost them the first winter. Second winter, lost a second hive. This is her third winter, and she's excited that her third colony is still alive. I don't want you to be doing what she has done, let's get it right on the first try.

I totally agree. I want them to live even I I don' get any excess honey the first year. Which I probably won't.

 

[TexasFreedom]

Generally you should never take honey off the hive in the first year. There are exceptions, but that is 85% typical. The bees need to learn their region, build everything inside (comb), etc etc. Call it 'overhead'. That takes a fair bit of effort and energy which takes away from nectar/pollen collections.

 

[user 7704]

Well, I placed my order today. I guess I'm official.

Talked to a local man who, along with others, have thousands of hives and they truck many of them out to Cali every year. He said they are doing avocados now, but doesnt do kiwi any more because they don' pay.

So is Cali running that low on bees that they have to ship them in from Tennessee. That's scary.

 

[TexasFreedom]

Not yet official! A friend got her boxes 2 years ago. And sadly they're still empty. But you may be close enough to hold your breath!

Moving hives is an industry in itself. A huge percentage of colonies move every few weeks to new customers. Avacados this week. Almonds next 3 weeks. Tomatoes after that... There is an East Coast 'circle' and a West Coast 'circle'. I can't remember, but something like 1/3rd or 1/2 of all hives go to CA for the almond crop. Almond makes some pollen but not much, but they pay really well, I think around $200 for a hive sitting there for 3 weeks. Keep in mind that moving hives is expensive, so it's not as profitable as it sounds (but it is good money).

Keep in mind, the more 'crop' the bees get from a plant the less it pays. 'Crop' meaning pollen/nectar. The idea is that if you are getting honey, that is supplemental to the cost of the bees sitting there. Most small BK are just local, no relocating of hives. But the 'big guys', with 10's of thousands of hives, they truck their colonies every week or two. But these big guys are also the ones losing 45+% of their colonies each year.

 

[user 7704]

Not yet official! A friend got her boxes 2 years ago. And sadly they're still empty. But you may be close enough to hold your breath!

Moving hives is an industry in itself. A huge percentage of colonies move every few weeks to new customers. Avacados this week. Almonds next 3 weeks. Tomatoes after that... There is an East Coast 'circle' and a West Coast 'circle'. I can't remember, but something like 1/3rd or 1/2 of all hives go to CA for the almond crop. Almond makes some pollen but not much, but they pay really well, I think around $200 for a hive sitting there for 3 weeks. Keep in mind that moving hives is expensive, so it's not as profitable as it sounds (but it is good money).

Keep in mind, the more 'crop' the bees get from a plant the less it pays. 'Crop' meaning pollen/nectar. The idea is that if you are getting honey, that is supplemental to the cost of the bees sitting there. Most small BK are just local, no relocating of hives. But the 'big guys', with 10's of thousands of hives, they truck their colonies every week or two. But these big guys are also the ones losing 45+% of their colonies each year.

It seems like a lot of work taking them cross country. He said he would be out there until March then he woyld bring th3m home to do their work locally

 

[TexasFreedom]

Robin,

Most of the people who do this take truckloads, 18 wheelers. They can fit 400+ colonies on 1 truck. The almond crops pay $200+ per hive for a few weeks. That's $80k for 1 truck, not chump change. But they need manpower for loading and unloading, and they have to feed the bees sugar water because the almond trees don't supply any nectar, and they have losses. But $80k pays for a whole lot of that.

But, don't worry about that. You are getting hive #1 soon. You are not a trucker. You are not a commercial BK. Let's focus on getting YOUR hives started, surviving, and go from there.

Don't get too far ahead of yourself.

 

[Mountain trapper]

My wife is going to be ordering her bees and hives soon for spring delivery. I think she's going to start out with 4 hives and expand from there. She's going to set the hives up near the orchard and garden area. I'll build a bear proof fence around the area where she wants the hives.

 

[Mountain trapper]

I'm looking at a out $400 for my start and I didn' think that was bad at all. I know not to expect much honey the first year. We pay $16 per quart for the honey we buy. So that will help offset some next year.

I basically want to help the environment and my gardens with the bees. If some little punk ass vandals ruin mine like the two instances in the news lately, I'll really ne mad then. $50k loss would be major.

$400 is a good start. I think my wife's "must have" list is up to around $3500 now. That includes all the processing equipment, extractor, tools, etc. The bees and hives are the cheap part of bee keeping. Oh, and her bee house was $4000. And of course she "needs" a deck added to her bee house so she can sit out and enjoy a cup of tea in the mornings. I better learn bee keeping too. Since she's gone most of the time I'll end up caring for the bees.

 

[TexasFreedom]

AD, come right into the best addiction you'll ever have!

A couple of words of advice.
#1: Your wife needs a mentor. Find a local BK club & join & attend every meeting
#2: GET A LOCAL MENTOR (just in case you missed that advice)
#3: with the local club, see if they have an extractor. Many clubs 'own' one and everyone borrows it for free.

If I break it down, let's see. 4 hives, $300/hive for the bodies/frames, $1200. Then bees are $150-400 per hive (package/nuc/complete hive), let's say $250 each (nuc?) so $1000 there. That leaves $1800 for equipment. That's a little high, but it depends on what she is getting. Now another reason not to get an extractor now: unless you get intact good hives, you will not get any honey off the hives the first year!

But I will add, if she wants to do cutouts, it'll cost you. I'd recommend getting a vehicle 100% dedicated to doing cutouts. It just makes it so much easier. Down here many of us just get a junker car/minivan & just leave everything in it, so we're ready to go when the call comes (time is critical with getting swarms). But if she's a newbie, she doesn't need to be at that level (but be ready if she does go that way). I will tell you doing cutouts is really enjoyable for many of us. Oh, a 'cutout' is when I remove a colony from someone's shed/deck/etc & take them home. "Free bees" are great, and you get really good genetics which matters.

As with Robin, I'm here to answer any questions. And you will have many. And if you missed it in previos posts, remember that 10 BK will give you at least 15 different opinions. Keep in mind my bees in Texas are different than by you. And other things are like the Ford/GM/Dodge debate: personal preferences.

 

[user 7704]

Arctic i I ordered my kit from a club and saved almost $100. You should check into that. I went to the company web page and compared. Same kits exactly.

 

[user 7704]

I painted my hives today. A grey color so that they won't be seen very easily. They are pretty far off the road, but some kids will desteoynthwm for the hell of it. Like when they stole my nature cam. They left the feeder and tree stand, but took the camera.

My mentor said he can't understand why people paint their hives bright colors and draw attention to them. I dont think the bees care if their hives are decorated.

 

[TexasFreedom]

Bright colors are great in a back yard. And yes, kids can be morons. I've seen hives shot point blank with a shotgun.

Only paint the outside of the body, leave bare wood inside. At least 2 coats outside.

 

[Mountain trapper]

The wife ordered her bees a couple of weeks ago for a May/june delivery. She plans on painting her hives when the weather gets warmer too, color choice unknown at this time. Bee hive vandalism isn't a problem at our location, but bears are a major concern.

 

[TexasFreedom]

Hot wire fences. Very HOT wire fences work great with bears. And check them often to make sure they don't short out.

(sarcasm on) But if you're a liberal, just put up a 'no bears permitted' sign. And no fence. Because according to liberals, you just need a 'law' to solve problems... and open borders are great. (sarcasm off)

 

[DrHenley]

Yup, just declare it a "Bear Free Zone" and if the bears come in anyhow, blame it on Trump and the NRA.

 

[TexasFreedom]

Doc,

Don't tell anyone, but did you know bears are part of the assault weapons problem? Think about this...

"bear" ends with AR. And if you search for "Bear 1500 pounds", you'll get over 12 million hits. So there you have, it, beAR-15, shortened to AR-15.

So, to say 'bear-free zone', you are saying code for 'gun free zone'. Is this too silly? (yes it is... but still a bit funny)

 

[Mountain trapper]

In the name of "animal rights", shouldn't we remove all fences? And let bears just run around wherever they want doing bear things? And speaking of animal rights, isn't bee keeping just another form of animal slavery? We make them live in a box, they work in the fields non stop until they die to produce a product, and then we take the fruits of their labor away from them.

 

[TexasFreedom]

AD,

Don't forget child abuse and separating families. When I split a hive, I separate the mother from 10's of thousands of her daughters! And I murder at least 10's if not 100's of bees every time I open the hive (crushed, sting me, rolled/killed...).

Oh, and doesn't that include violation of the privacy rights? Who do I think I am, the gov't?

 

[user 7704]

Well, I've discovered that bee math is like chicken math. You say you are going to have a few and then whoosh, you have a large flock.

I've lready been talked into having two hives instead of one. It really made sense to me. So hey.

 

[Mountain trapper]

Well, I've discovered that bee math is like chicken math. You say you are going to have a few and then whoosh, you have a large flock.

I've lready been talked into having two hives instead of one. It really made sense to me. So hey.

Yeah. My wife is already talking about getting 3 more hives next year. We just need to find a location to set them up.

 

[DrPrepper1]

I painted my hives today. A grey color so that they won't be seen very easily. They are pretty far off the road, but some kids will desteoynthwm for the hell of it. Like when they stole my nature cam. They left the feeder and tree stand, but took the camera.

My mentor said he can't understand why people paint their hives bright colors and draw attention to them. I dont think the bees care if their hives are decorated.

What kind of paint do you use? Spray paint? Do the bees come after you when you try to paint? I never heard of this, fascinating. I was curious about bee keeping, but I don’t think I have the room. I have a large Cat Mint plant and the bees are all over it. There is no honey or anything involved, but I love watching them. I don’t know what kind of bees they are, but they never chase or sting anyone. You can get really close to them.

 

[SheilaT.]

Hive theft is big business over here so a lot of Beekeepers have taken to keeping their hives in small shipping containers with holes drilled in the sides for the Bees to go in and out.

 

[user 7704]

What kind of paint do you use? Spray paint? Do the bees come after you when you try to paint? I never heard of this, fascinating. I was curious about bee keeping, but I don’t think I have the room. I have a large Cat Mint plant and the bees are all over it. There is no honey or anything involved, but I love watching them. I don’t know what kind of bees they are, but they never chase or sting anyone. You can get really close to them.

Mine are bare wood so I painted with some old porch paint I have
You do this before you get the bees.

 

[user 7704]

Hive theft is big business over here so a lot of Beekeepers have taken to keeping their hives in small shipping containers with holes drilled in the sides for the Bees to go in and out.

Young kids and bad neighbors destroyed complete colonies here. $50,000 each

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

Good luck everyone with your bees! My former neighbors had 3 hives that looked like Japanese temples lol. They were pretty cool, but you couldn't see them from the road.

As soon as we are out of town, my wife and I plan on getting a couple hives. If I get the Airstream I want (please sell it to me) it should come with a bunch of boxes and equipment, its being used as hive storage right now, and the owners kids don't want to have bees.

Bees have always seemed to me to be one of the coolest things you could get into. Amazing insects, and you get some honey to boot. Plus, a reason to grow tons of flowers.

 

[user 7704]

Good luck everyone with your bees! My former neighbors had 3 hives that looked like Japanese temples lol. They were pretty cool, but you couldn't see them from the road.

As soon as we are out of town, my wife and I plan on getting a couple hives. If I get the Airstream I want (please sell it to me) it should come with a bunch of boxes and equipment, its being used as hive storage right now, and the owners kids don't want to have bees.

Bees have always seemed to me to be one of the coolest things you could get into. Amazing insects, and you get some honey to boot. Plus, a reason to grow tons of flowers.

I'm going to plant extra clover too. I have 3 veggie gardens and I grow a few perennial, but I'm going to plant more bee friendly flowers. I cut lots of trees for the wedding so I have more sun.