I am not defending the shooter, I am just pointing out that he used the right weapons and accessories to accomplish his misson....I have no authority by man or God to say what you or anybody can or cannot own and vice versa......I did not miss your point, You kept saying they had no use and obviously they do, whether it be for a crazy criminal to use or by a couple guys having fun at the range.....and the Law abiding gun owner should not be penalized because of a crazy guy, that has happened way to much in recent years, Millions get penalized for one person.....when a bunch of people get killed by chemicals, fertilizer bomb, knives, vehicles or flying planes into buildings, do we stop that too ? We have not stopped any of the other items that can kills massive amounts of people....The 2nd Amendment is very short and simple.....IF you are as Pro Gun as you say ? then the 2nd Amendment should be the only thing that matters.....Guns are regulated to death now and it has never stopped a crazy person from doing harm......making those stocks Illegal will not stop anything....they can be simply made just like someone can Illegally convert a rifle to full auto....What will you do about that ? make Machine tools illegal ? Suppressors are easy made, do we ban the materials they are made from ? where does this end ? It ends with the people paying the taxes that carry this Country getting screwed again....I'm tired of being screwed when I have done nothing wrong, hopefully you are to.....
LAS VEGAS Mass shooting at Country & Western Concert
- Thread starter Silent Earth
- Start date
Help Support Homesteading & Country Living Forum:
I am not defending the shooter, I am just pointing out that he used the right weapons and accessories to accomplish his misson....I have no authority by man or God to say what you or anybody can or cannot own and vice versa......I did not miss your point, You kept saying they had no use and obviously they do, whether it be for a crazy criminal to use or by a couple guys having fun at the range.....and the Law abiding gun owner should not be penalized because of a crazy guy, that has happened way to much in recent years, Millions get penalized for one person.....when a bunch of people get killed by chemicals, fertilizer bomb, knives, vehicles or flying planes into buildings, do we stop that too ? We have not stopped any of the other items that can kills massive amounts of people....The 2nd Amendment is very short and simple.....IF you are as Pro Gun as you say ? then the 2nd Amendment should be the only thing that matters.....Guns are regulated to death now and it has never stopped a crazy person from doing harm......making those stocks Illegal will not stop anything....they can be simply made just like someone can Illegally convert a rifle to full auto....What will you do about that ? make Machine tools illegal ? Suppressors are easy made, do we ban the materials they are made from ? where does this end ? It ends with the people paying the taxes that carry this Country getting screwed again....I'm tired of being screwed when I have done nothing wrong, hopefully you are to.....
Why does average joe need a 1000 hp sports car ? he doesn't......BUT this is America......If he wants and can afford it he can have it......the 2nd Amendment is not a need, it is a Right....If average joe wants to go the range with a bumpfire stock on his gun and shoot 1000 rounds of ammo ? who are you to say he cannot ? who am I to say he cannot ?
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2016
- Messages
- 6,474
come on comparing a car to what this man did,is not even close to the same thing,,,,but you go ahead,and think what you want and get mad if they take them away,,,,,,,,,,,,,me I will not shed a single tear over the loss of bump stocks or if they ban the purchase of kits to convert a rifle to full auto or even go so far as to confiscate full auto weapons
after this shooting these items will be under extreme scrutiny and in my opinion it is better to lose a little than to lose it all which is what the anti gun people really want
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2013
- Messages
- 16,312
Because he wants one. That's reason enough for me.
Bottom line the Government does not need to ban anything or pass any laws . I don't want them infringing on any firearm related issues . Like all other such tragedies it will surface that someone could have came forward and had this stopped before it happened. Its crime control needed not big government interference.
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2013
- Messages
- 16,312
Because he wants one. That's reason enough for me. And besides, who is going to decide what a person "needs"?
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2013
- Messages
- 16,312
.
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2016
- Messages
- 6,474
well I can see I am beating my head against a brick wall here,,,,so I will leave you people with this,,,,,,,,,,,,watch now that some idiot has done this ,there will be copycats,more than likely several,,,,,,,,can you live with it knowing we don't really have to have everything we want
The comparison is as good as any since you brought up the ( need ) for something that is Legal to own......I could comment all night on why people ( need ) things......I never said your opinion on the matter was wrong, you clearly stated no one needed them.....and I countered with another need that people have.....None of us need a lot of things, even you.....I never said you had too many guns, why do you need more than one ? You don't need more than one, you don't need anymore, But I would not say that to anyone...I don't care what you feel you need or want, none of my business.....it is also none of your business that people want a bumpfire stock....nor do I or you have the right to tell them they do not need it.....If your buying groceries and I'm standing behind you and tell you that you don't need that six pack or that steak, what would you say ? If you were at local gun shop looking at a new pistol and some guy walks up and say's, Hey man, You don't need that pistol.....what would you say ? I would say mind your own business......go look on GunBroker or any number of Class 3 Dealer websites and look at what a full auto rifle that you could buy costs......as much as a nice truck.....the very few available are very costly, that is why shootings that involve real full automatics weapons can be counted on your hand in the last 50 years.....this has never been a gun issue.....or a Legal gun part issue.....
The Democrat leaders are kicking off their gun grabbing campaign. Nancy and Joe leading the charge .
If any copycat shootings happen, it will still be because of the person, not the gun......or the gun parts.....you are not beating your head against a wall....none of us can have it both ways, you gotta chose which way you will go....and by all means go the way you want, I won't ever tell you to go my way. I will support and speak out how I feel about it though, which should be obvious by now.....lol
Ghost I see your point and the reasoning behind it. Unfortunately I don't believe increased regulation or new firearm laws are the answer here as they wouldn't have prevented this tragedy from occurring in the first place.
The media is trying to exploit this tragedy and divide the country once again with this gun debate for increased ratings on their end. People are getting triggered both left and right.
If there is anything most of us here agree on...its the right to bear arms. The media stirs the pot and everyone's taking the bait. Both sides are doing it.
The media is trying to exploit this tragedy and divide the country once again with this gun debate for increased ratings on their end. People are getting triggered both left and right.
If there is anything most of us here agree on...its the right to bear arms. The media stirs the pot and everyone's taking the bait. Both sides are doing it.
Hammers , knives , ball bats even bare hands do not get blamed for the crime committed by someone. No call to ban cars and booze when someone is killed by a drunk driver .
Blame the criminal, do not give the criminal a pass its their fault .
Blame the criminal, do not give the criminal a pass its their fault .
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2013
- Messages
- 16,312
What this guy did was already clearly against the law. How can passing any more laws, or banning anything going to stop the next person from doing something similar? Does any rational thinking person really think that had the bump stock been banned that it would have stopped this guy?? Hardly.
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2013
- Messages
- 18,373
The purpose of the 2nd Amendment was to allow citizens to be able to resist a tyrannical government. That means military grade weapons, not squirrel rifles.
As Jefferson said: Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem
Which has been translated various ways:
"I prefer dangerous liberty over peaceful slavery."
"I prefer the tumult of liberty over the quiet of servitude"
In other words freedom is dangerous. And the only way to completely remove the danger is to enslave the people.
We still don't know how many bump stocks are involved. News reports say anywhere from 1 to 12. But they have garnered enough attention that Congress is almost certain to do something. I think what is going to happen is that the 1934 NFA and possibly the 1968 GCA are going to be amended to include bump stocks as Class III NFA weapons. Then you will need your local chief law enforcement officer to sign off on an application for a bump stock license, then you pay your $200 and wait for approval by the ATF. Still "legal," but highly regulated.
As Jefferson said: Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem
Which has been translated various ways:
"I prefer dangerous liberty over peaceful slavery."
"I prefer the tumult of liberty over the quiet of servitude"
In other words freedom is dangerous. And the only way to completely remove the danger is to enslave the people.
We still don't know how many bump stocks are involved. News reports say anywhere from 1 to 12. But they have garnered enough attention that Congress is almost certain to do something. I think what is going to happen is that the 1934 NFA and possibly the 1968 GCA are going to be amended to include bump stocks as Class III NFA weapons. Then you will need your local chief law enforcement officer to sign off on an application for a bump stock license, then you pay your $200 and wait for approval by the ATF. Still "legal," but highly regulated.
That is a possibility to reclassify them.....Then the ATF in all of it's glory could shelve all applications to buy one for 18 months before approving.....My SBR Stamp took 90 days....local class 3 dealer said Suppressor Stamps are taking 16-18 months.....this shooting will probably take it out to 24 now......it will be a crazy period of time But, remember those same Congressmen will be protected by Fully Automatic Weapons because they are after all better than us Law abiding Tax payers......
I agree and I think Ghost understands this as well. I think what he was implying was that they're going to try to take something...better to give up something to shut them up.
As you said...it wouldn't have prevented this. I don't think any laws or regulations could have prevented this short of banning ALL firearms altogether which will never happen.
I don't think anything is going to come of this. The media is going to try to milk this for as long as the people's attention span allows for.
Eventually Kim Jung Un will step on his prick again and everyone will refocus on that situation.
Last edited:
Evil is evil does, doesn't matter whats available, focusing on the instrument of choice doesn't solve the unsolvable problem timothy mcveigh proved that without the use of a firearm 168 dead, add the World Trade Centers 2996 dead so lets put all the focus on the firearm and attachments in this case? it doesn't make sense, the whole recent killing spree doesn't make sense just like all others before it regardless what was used!
Availability of choice doesn't make one a killer, he/she were already a killer before the choice of instruments were selected period!
Availability of choice doesn't make one a killer, he/she were already a killer before the choice of instruments were selected period!
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2016
- Messages
- 6,474
this incident is over the top,and just what the LEFT needs to push new gun laws,the BUMP STOCK is a sacrificial lamb,the Left has been pushing for new laws for as long as I can remember,which would you rather see all military assault type weapons banned or the Bump Stock,,,,,even the NRA can see this, as reasonably intelligent people you all should be able to see this,,,good night,I will see you all in a few days
Joe Biden and Nancy P both said right off the bat when the NRA said bump stock classification should be looked at that the bunp stock issue is not near enough. Biden said plainly that anyone that thinks banning the bump stock is enough must be smoking something.
I do not think the gun grabbing left will make any gains but the fight is on . And like in the past if gun owners do not fight the fight lawmakers will walk over Us .
I do not think the gun grabbing left will make any gains but the fight is on . And like in the past if gun owners do not fight the fight lawmakers will walk over Us .
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2013
- Messages
- 16,312
That's the way the Leftists work. They keep chipping away at out rights and freedoms little by little. And they know the spineless Republicans will always roll over and give in a little at a time. Does anyone really think that it we throw them a bone, in this case the bump stock, that they'll be satisfied with stopping there?? That's wishful thinking. And again, how would banning the bump stock do ANYTHING to prevent this from happening again?? What do we agree to give up next time?
Do I NEED my 50 + firearms?
H#ll no!
Do I want my firearms?
H#ll YES!
Will I buy more? Like I did today on an gun auction site?
H#ll YES.
Do I NEED my 50,000 + rounds of ammo?
H#LL NO!
It's WANT not NEED.
I buy ammo as I can afford it.
It ain't getting any cheaper very soon.
Most of my ammo supply is .22 rim fire.
.22 r.f. is what I shoot most.
I keep at least 100 rounds per caliber for my handguns.
600 at a minimum for my 5.56/.223 rifles.
200 at a minimum for my .308/7.62 rifles.
Lots of empty cases, bullets, primers, and powder to reload.
I don't ever expect to need defending me and mine but .....................
well this is a preppers forum isn't it.
By the way. I realize one can't eat bullets no matter how long they are
boiled. :>)
I CAN take all manner of game however.
I have fun shooting my guns at my back yard 125 yard range too!
H#ll no!
Do I want my firearms?
H#ll YES!
Will I buy more? Like I did today on an gun auction site?
H#ll YES.
Do I NEED my 50,000 + rounds of ammo?
H#LL NO!
It's WANT not NEED.
I buy ammo as I can afford it.
It ain't getting any cheaper very soon.
Most of my ammo supply is .22 rim fire.
.22 r.f. is what I shoot most.
I keep at least 100 rounds per caliber for my handguns.
600 at a minimum for my 5.56/.223 rifles.
200 at a minimum for my .308/7.62 rifles.
Lots of empty cases, bullets, primers, and powder to reload.
I don't ever expect to need defending me and mine but .....................
well this is a preppers forum isn't it.
By the way. I realize one can't eat bullets no matter how long they are
boiled. :>)
I CAN take all manner of game however.
I have fun shooting my guns at my back yard 125 yard range too!
Law abiding gun owners have given up 1000's of concessions to the Anti-gun crowd....look at California, New York, Illinois, Maryland and some of the big cities in other states...HOW MUCH DO WE KEEP GIVING ?? We have gave 1000's of sacrificial lambs and it does not stop....How can any Pro Gun person mean they are Pro Gun and keep giving stuff up ? The NRA is a ( Political ) Organization....They do not speak for me and never have.....Everything they do is based on Politics.....They say they believe in exactly what the 2nd Amendment is, Do they ? It's not about how intelligent anyone is, It's about a Corrupt Government being led by Greedy, I will Control you POS who keep taking...It's not about Bumpfire stocks, It's about the constant attack on People's Rights....If you can't see that then there is no hope to change your mind....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_homicide_rate
Like I said before both sides of the media have the same agenda...RATINGS. People are brainwashed. The more triggered people get...the higher ratings go. When looking at homicide rates the media often only goes back a year or two...particularly after a spike.
You have to go back further 10 to 20 years to understand that OVERALL homicide rates are actually on gradual decline throughout most of the country.
Stop falling for the click bait news.
Like I said before both sides of the media have the same agenda...RATINGS. People are brainwashed. The more triggered people get...the higher ratings go. When looking at homicide rates the media often only goes back a year or two...particularly after a spike.
You have to go back further 10 to 20 years to understand that OVERALL homicide rates are actually on gradual decline throughout most of the country.
Stop falling for the click bait news.
Like I said...brainwashed.
The NRA is a ( Political ) Organization....They do not speak for me and never have.....Everything they do is based on Politics bsflag
Well no kidding.
Who else LOBBIES in D.C. against the anti gun
lobbies and politicians?
Just google NRA + politics and read how REALLY political the NRA
is.
It's SUPPOSED to be political.
The National Rifle Association donates millions of dollars every year to Republican lawmakers in Congress. And those same Republicans line up uniformly to block proposed gun control legislation.
No one can fix ignorant now can they? Please get educated on FACTS
prior to inserting foot in mouth.
Wow...........just wow.:lame:
Well no kidding.
Who else LOBBIES in D.C. against the anti gun
lobbies and politicians?
Just google NRA + politics and read how REALLY political the NRA
is.
It's SUPPOSED to be political.
The National Rifle Association donates millions of dollars every year to Republican lawmakers in Congress. And those same Republicans line up uniformly to block proposed gun control legislation.
No one can fix ignorant now can they? Please get educated on FACTS
prior to inserting foot in mouth.
Wow...........just wow.
:lame:The NRA is a ( Political ) Organization....They do not speak for me and never have.....Everything they do is based on Politics bsflag
Well no kidding.
Who else LOBBIES in D.C. against the anti gun
lobbies and politicians?
Just google NRA + politics and read how REALLY political the NRA
is.
It's SUPPOSED to be political.
The National Rifle Association donates millions of dollars every year to Republican lawmakers in Congress. And those same Republicans line up uniformly to block proposed gun control legislation.
No one can fix ignorant now can they? Please get educated on FACTS
prior to inserting foot in mouth.
Wow...........just wow.
LOL....what did I say that was not true ? I said NRA is a Political Organization....and you said the same....True ?
I do not give money to them so they do not speak for ( me ) The 2nd Amendment speaks clearly for me......Very True.
I never said the NRA did not do good things, did I ?
Those same Republicans have also voted to take Gun Rights......Very True
Everything I posted was FACTS.....what don't you understand ???
sounds like someone else opened mouth and inserted foot ?
NRA became more politicized in the 70s, it never really got involved with politics until the 1930s. It started out as a firearm competency and safety organization in the 1880s for those that don't know. I've been a life member for 40 or so yrs, I don't always agree with the NRA especially when it comes to bargaining my rights but they do a lot of good outside the realm of politics including fighting to keep many Federal lands open to hunting etc.. Like all organizations their are going to be likes and dislikes.
Homicide rates by country per 100,000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
U.S.A. 4.8 per 100,000
Guyana 19.42 per 100,000
Venezuela 57.15 per 100,000
See link for more information.
Bear in mind that the U.S.A. is the only nation in the world with anything
like a 2nd Amendment.
Also the U.S. is a VAST melting pot of races, religions, and cultures.
The U.S.A. has more guns in private hands than households yet
still does not have anything close to the highest homicide rate.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
U.S.A. 4.8 per 100,000
Guyana 19.42 per 100,000
Venezuela 57.15 per 100,000
See link for more information.
Bear in mind that the U.S.A. is the only nation in the world with anything
like a 2nd Amendment.
Also the U.S. is a VAST melting pot of races, religions, and cultures.
The U.S.A. has more guns in private hands than households yet
still does not have anything close to the highest homicide rate.
