Rant for the Day (keep it clean)

[Haertig]

Sorry, I did not intend to offend anyone. There are always exceptions to any generalization. I was thinking of the people who spend every dime they make without even considering their retirement. My son is one of these people. My daughter is exactly the opposite.

e.g., I do not mind giving a helping hand to those in need. We donate lots of money through our church for this purpose. But I do not like giving money as free handouts to people who simply have decided not to work and prefer to live off of others when they could work for themselves.

It is people that are similar to this latter group that I was talking about in my post about retirement savings above. The people who buy themselves a Mercedes when heir finances are more along the lines of a used Beetle. The two family household with an 8000 square foot house. People intentionally living above their means. There is nothing wrong with spending your money on luxuries if you can afford them. But ignoring your retirement is not "being able to afford" these things IMHO.

 

[Peanut]

Sorry, I did not intend to offend anyone. There are always exceptions to any generalization. I was thinking of the people who spend every dime they make without even considering their retirement. My son is one of these people. My daughter is exactly the opposite.

e.g., I do not mind giving a helping hand to those in need. We donate lots of money through our church for this purpose. But I do not like giving money as free handouts to people who simply have decided not to work and prefer to live off of others when they could work for themselves.

It is people that are similar to this latter group that I was talking about in my post about retirement savings above. The people who buy themselves a Mercedes when heir finances are more along the lines of a used Beetle. The two family household with an 8000 square foot house. People intentionally living above their means. There is nothing wrong with spending your money on luxuries if you can afford them. But ignoring your retirement is not "being able to afford" these things IMHO.

You are correct... I too know people who waste everything they earn foolishly.

I wasn't offended, just wanted to point out a large number of folks had no choice in the matter... Just looked it up on the cdc website, these numbers even surprised me... I didn't expect 28.7%, maybe 15%.

I go to places where other disabled people go, so I see them. Normal healthy folks usually don't so it's understandable we are overlooked. And to be fair I see quite a few folks who I suspect are faking it... just looking for an easy way out. Always #$%$ me off when one crosses my path.

 

[Supervisor42]

Irresponsible? At age 40 my entire life's savings went to doctors... just hoping one could find or do something so I could continue my 6 figure career. All to no avail! By 42 I was broke with no way to earn anything. Cash money? forget about it! Nothing but a govt. check and half of that went to those same doctors for the next 10yrs.

There are a lot of people like me, far more than many would guess... for the most part we are invisible to normal society simply because we can't live like most people. Your friends are the first to drift away, since you can no longer do the things that bring you together. Heck, I'm invisible to most of my family. Except for the occasional holiday or funeral they wouldn't know I existed either. Out of sight, out of mind, it's surprising when that becomes the ruling philosophy of your life. And I'm one of the lucky ones.. I'm sitting on 100acres of prime farmland. At some point a real estate company will care enough to visit. And irresponsibility had nothing to do with it...

edit to add... just looked it up on the cdc website... 28% of the adults in the US have a disability. Maybe that's explains the 20% with no savings...

Thanks for your story.
It reminded me just how 'fortunate' I have been. Everything went fine for my working career and i was able to save for my 'golden years' for decades.
So many things fell right into place, at just the right time, I look back in amazement.
Today I am living my dream. No, I don't have any expensive toys, and my truck is a 2002...
But I go to sleep every night in total comfort that I can beat any challenge that life can throw at me.

Now folks, this is a prime example of what a rant is not! Sorry.

 

[Magpie]

Now folks, this is a prime example of what a rant is not! Sorry.

So what we need is a thread titled 'I have nothing to rant about' rant

 

[dademoss]

WEATHER T shirt yesterday, winter coat tomorrow, darned weather

 

[sonya123]

Irresponsible? At age 40 my entire life's savings went to doctors... just hoping one could find or do something so I could continue my 6 figure career. All to no avail! By 42 I was broke with no way to earn anything. Cash money? forget about it! Nothing but a govt. check and half of that went to those same doctors for the next 10yrs.

I was going to rant about the weather but this is making me want to say something completely else here. I know most of you are now going to call me a "communist" but I don't care. I think the US should have universal health insurance for EVERYONE. The only people benefitting from the system the way it is are the insurance companies and hospital administrators. I HAVE lived in a country with better medical system and my relatives still do. I know so many people in the US don't want that system, but it really is better. You don't have to worry about 1 accident or medical emergency making you bankcrupt . All that stuff about "they let people die " and you can't get a doctor is all BS. They have kept my dad alive for almost 20 years with his massive heart problems . My brother has no problem going to a doctor in France either. He has 2 blood pressure meds and a colesterol meds just like people do here. My niece was born premature and she is fine now, they didn't let her die in the hospital.
The cost is LOWER per person that what gets spent in the US. And you don't have to worry about it. Health insurance is NOT tied to a job. Plus you CAN get private insurance if you want to ( but most people don't want it) . I used to work with people that only kept their job for the health insurance. Thats just crap. Plus poor people get treated in the hospital anyway. The rest of population is paying for it. IT's like everything else in US politics! Instead of doing what benefits ALL the population, they play different groups off against each other so they can get rich and get votes! YOU are losing out here, THEY are not. Done with my rant

We are currently on Medicaid and I love it. We have no medical bills and no concerns about having to go to the hospital and not being able to pay. We are on Medicaid because we have very low income. We would not be able to live like we do in States like Texas or Florida . Not that I want to live there....but I hope you get my point.

 

[dademoss]

I was going to rant about the weather but this is making me want to say something completely else here. I know most of you are now going to call me a "communist" but I don't care. I think the US should have universal health insurance for EVERYONE. The only people benefitting from the system the way it is are the insurance companies and hospital administrators. I HAVE lived in a country with better medical system and my relatives still do. I know so many people in the US don't want that system, but it really is better. You don't have to worry about 1 accident or medical emergency making you bankcrupt . All that stuff about "they let people die " and you can't get a doctor is all BS. They have kept my dad alive for almost 20 years with his massive heart problems . My brother has no problem going to a doctor in France either. He has 2 blood pressure meds and a colesterol meds just like people do here. My niece was born premature and she is fine now, they didn't let her die in the hospital.
The cost is LOWER per person that what gets spent in the US. And you don't have to worry about it. Health insurance is NOT tied to a job. Plus you CAN get private insurance if you want to ( but most people don't want it) . I used to work with people that only kept their job for the health insurance. Thats just crap. Plus poor people get treated in the hospital anyway. The rest of population is paying for it. IT's like everything else in US politics! Instead of doing what benefits ALL the population, they play different groups off against each other so they can get rich and get votes! YOU are losing out here, THEY are not. Done with my rant

We are currently on Medicaid and I love it. We have no medical bills and no concerns about having to go to the hospital and not being able to pay. We are on Medicaid because we have very low income. We would not be able to live like we do in States like Texas or Florida . Not that I want to live there....but I hope you get my point.

My response would make the Mods move it to political, so I will pass.

 

[Amish Heart]

I'm ticked that the medical system didn't want to "waste resources" on older people during covid. And then last year, saw that attitude with mom. She would of been 92 yesterday, passed last April at 91. At a point, the docs just figure that you are old, and oh well. A waste of resources. Starting to see that attitude with my husband's docs a bit. And he is 71.
I don't think Canadian universal health sounds good at all. Seems like they are busy trying to kill old people, too, and want to also do the sex change operations on kids. But a Canadian might want to weigh in on that.

 

[Pearl]

Medicaid IS NOT universal healthcare! I knew a gal in Canada who was waiting for her appointment with an oncologist! Thanks to universal healthcare the wait was six months!! She died before her appointed appointment!

 

[Amish Heart]

I know in 1985, waiting to get in to the woman's hospital in Cannes, France because I was pregnant. Wasn't going to happen, the wait was longer than I would be pregnant. And I checked right away. So we paid a private doc to do my health checks and lab work and Rhogam shot. Ended up flying back to the states 4 weeks before due to have our son. It was ridiculous.

 

[Magpie]

I was going to rant about the weather but this is making me want to say something completely else here. I know most of you are now going to call me a "communist" but I don't care. I think the US should have universal health insurance for EVERYONE. The only people benefitting from the system the way it is are the insurance companies and hospital administrators. I HAVE lived in a country with better medical system and my relatives still do. I know so many people in the US don't want that system, but it really is better. You don't have to worry about 1 accident or medical emergency making you bankcrupt . All that stuff about "they let people die " and you can't get a doctor is all BS. They have kept my dad alive for almost 20 years with his massive heart problems . My brother has no problem going to a doctor in France either. He has 2 blood pressure meds and a colesterol meds just like people do here. My niece was born premature and she is fine now, they didn't let her die in the hospital.
The cost is LOWER per person that what gets spent in the US. And you don't have to worry about it. Health insurance is NOT tied to a job. Plus you CAN get private insurance if you want to ( but most people don't want it) . I used to work with people that only kept their job for the health insurance. Thats just crap. Plus poor people get treated in the hospital anyway. The rest of population is paying for it. IT's like everything else in US politics! Instead of doing what benefits ALL the population, they play different groups off against each other so they can get rich and get votes! YOU are losing out here, THEY are not. Done with my rant

We are currently on Medicaid and I love it. We have no medical bills and no concerns about having to go to the hospital and not being able to pay. We are on Medicaid because we have very low income. We would not be able to live like we do in States like Texas or Florida . Not that I want to live there....but I hope you get my point.

Have to agree with Sonya's comment about insurance companies getting the profit. I feel its one of the worlds biggest scams.
We have public health insurance, with the option to pay for private. The public sector is funded through wage taxes, or 'Pay Related Social Insurance' which the worker pays out of salary weekly/monthly and the employer contributes to also. There is an issue in that because people are living longer, there are smaller families which mean less paying into the revenue system, and medical staff are moving abroad, there are longer waiting lists, but in general, it works. If you are below the threshold, you get a health card, or a doctor only card. The first covers everything. The second allows you to see a GP for free, but you pay for prescriptions. Under 6's have free care, and I think that age is increasing. Women between 17 and 35 have free contraception, and all colleges/uni's offer free condoms or medical assistance on campus. All children get hearing and dental checks through school, and vaccinations also. Two of mine required speech therapy when they were young- several 6 week sessions over a few years, all covered by the state/our taxes. I also had two premature babies. No bills, despite 6 week stays. I asked a nurse about the girl in the private room, what was different. 'She gets posher cutlery' was the reply.
We do have waiting lists, but no one gets turned away from a hospital because they can't pay. If I was to have an accident while in Europe, the same applies. 30 years ago I was working in the UK and became ill - this is before the EU/Brexit etc. I was admitted to hosp and taken well care of by their National Health Service, no bills.
I feel the worry of the bill makes peoples health worse in the US, and see far too many people discharge themselves before they should. I have a wealthy relation in NY who was quite cocky about his insurance plans- the day someone ran a red light and hit him he found he was treated the same as the guy in the next bed; and ten years later his arm still isn't right.
One incident should not wipe out a lifetime of work or leave your family bankrupt.

 

[Haertig]

I think it boils down to "people without health insurance or with poor quality health insurance want universal health care, those who have good health insurance do not want universal health care".

This is only natural because if you don't have good health insurance, universal health care improves your situation. But if you have good health insurance, universal health care makes your situation worse.

In my case, I would vote for universal health insurance for my kids, but I would vote against it for my wife and I.

I agree that insurance companies probably are making out like bandits. And I don't like that insurance companies are calling the shots in what is and is not allowable care. But I do not agree that universal health care is the fix. This just brings everybody down to the lowest common denominator. The bottom line is that people who have more money, better jobs, higher education, etc. just get better things in life. Better houses, better cars, better education, better clothes, better food, better medical care. That's just the way it is. This is capitalism. If people don't like the unfairness of that, then there is communism. Plenty of unfairness there too. You have socialism squeezed in between those two extremes. There's plenty of both goodness and badness in socialism. You have the northern European countries that have done it fairly well, and then you have Venezuela that has done it badly.

Nothing is a panacea. Not even universal health care. If we were forced to vote on universal health care or not, I would tend to vote for it these days (that is a big change from what I would have said a few years ago). I would not support it whole hog, but I would be open to discussing it. To benefit my children. Fully realizing that it would be bad for me and my friends. There will always be trade-offs. There is no "solution". Nothing will solve all the problems. When you solve one problem, you create another. When you solve the one you just created, a different problem comes to the forefront. Ignoring families as a motivational factor for the moment, people are going to support what is best for them, not for others. And whether a specific thing benefits or harms them may change over their lifetime.

 

[Pearl]

We loved our insurance before Obamacare took it away!

 

[Peanut]

Having worked in healthcare in both the US and europe in the 90’s I got to see both systems from the inside. I also got to see both as a patient, actually had emergency surgery while working in france.

The one big plus in the US system was our medical innovation. It was not matched anywhere in the world, bar none. That’s where all that money was going. Insurance companies were investing those profits in medical technology.

I worked r&d in medical imagining. r&d costs a lot of money, our systems sold for $5 million ea. It took us 7 years to develop an amazing technology, something no other system in the world could do, a new kind of catscan... but by 1997 we could quantify soft plaque in the coronary arteries before it calcified. We could do this non-invasively, no needles, over in 5min, simple. It literally prevented 1000’s of heart attacks. Could identify the start of a blockage years before there was any calcium. I saw people scanned everyday!

But at $5 million per system who could afford it? Here in the states both public and private hospitals could. Over 40 systems in the US, heck, the mayo clinic had 3 of our systems. In europe only a few countries could only afford just 1 system. Most countries couldn’t afford one at all. The technology being used in europe at the time was 20yrs behind the tech here in the states. But wealthy people in europe didn’t go without. They flew to the states for this advanced medical care…

What’s the answer? I don’t know. There has to be a way to combine the two systems taking the best of each. There is no excuse for people waiting months for a conventional catscan or mri. Both are 40yr old tech… yet people in canada and europe are still coming to the US for either. Heck there used to be daily buses from Toronto to Buffalo ny for medical procedures. I worked in Buffalo 2 yrs, saw Canadian patients lining up every day for catscans and mri's.

 

[sonya123]

I think it boils down to "people without health insurance or with poor quality health insurance want universal health care, those who have good health insurance do not want universal health care".

This is only natural because if you don't have good health insurance, universal health care improves your situation. But if you have good health insurance, universal health care makes your situation worse.

In my case, I would vote for universal health insurance for my kids, but I would vote against it for my wife and I.

That's a sort of misconception . Think about it, you say you have good health insurance, but so do I. The healthcare would not change, just the way it is paid for. That's something Americans seem to not get. I get the same healthcare you get and I pay nothing. When I had a job, the company paid around $12000 a year for me ( without any sort of preexisting conditions when I was younger) . It is probably way more now, this was around 10 years ago. When I was young and had my kids, I still had to pay for coopayments, and birthcontrol pills and going to the eyedoctor and dentist wasn't included either. I asked my brother last time I talked to him and he has $200 a month taken out of his pay for medical , which includes everything. That's a lot less than $12000 a year I got taken out of mine when I was working. And if my brother loses his job , he will still have that insurance and still have the same healthcare.
Here if you lose your job, you can get something called Cobra, which most people when they become unemployed can't afford. So all it takes is someone to have a major accident, lose their job as a result and they are bankcrupt.
But , the illegals here and the ghetto trash gets everything paid for .

I worked with someone that had a kid with a very expensive medical condition, I forget what it's called, something with the digestive system. When they were layoffs he got laid off because the company tried to get rid of people that cost more in health insurance. He ended up bankcrupt also. I have known several people this sort of thing happened to. It's sad really. You are gambling nothing bad will happen to you

I don't know anything about Canadian healthcare btw

 

[SLADE]

I paid 18.000 a year for family plan. 4 people that did not use it. That covers 80 percent.
This is not a great country for medical care. Any claims to the contrary seem to be nothing but political BS

 

[sonya123]

What’s the answer? I don’t know. There has to be a way to combine the two systems taking the best of each. There is no excuse for people waiting months for a simple catscan or mri. Both are 40yr old tech… yet people in canada and europe are still coming to the US for either. Heck there used to be daily buses from Toronto to Buffalo ny for medical procedures. I worked in Buffalo 2 yrs, saw Canadian patients lining up every day for catscans and mri's.

I get what you are saying ( but they have those things in Europe now also) but at the same time I do wonder how many of those things are unnecessary to start and just ways for hospitals to make money. I had both this year when I went to the hospital for the covid /flu thing, and imo it was not necessary. It didn't turn up anything and they wasted a lot of time and resources on nothing and sent me home with a prescription for over the counter medicine . Waste of money.
I have had this sort of thing happen before, everytime you go to a hospital for anything they want to do a MRI on you or other scan.
All it did was cause me stress LOL
My personal believe is that maybe we would have a healthier population if not everyone was kept alive regardless of condition, if that makes any sense. But nobody should go bankcrupt at a young age because they had to have their appendix removed or something

 

[sonya123]

We loved our insurance before Obamacare took it away!

Obamacare sucks, that is not what I had in mind....

 

[Peanut]

I have had this sort of thing happen before, everytime you go to a hospital for anything they want to do a MRI on you or other scan.

Making my point, high tech is so common place here in the states that it's used frivolously. Yet people in europe and canada wait months for a necessary ct or mri.

Money is why high tech is common place here. It's what drives the advancements in medical tech and procedures.

 

[Haertig]

That's a sort of misconception ... The healthcare would not change, just the way it is paid for.

In my personal experience, the statement above is the misconception.

"The way it is paid for" includes the scenario "it will not be paid for". And when that happens, the healthcare disappears - which I would call a "change to healthcare" (to put it mildly).

Case in point was my uncle-in-law. Canadian. Universal health care or whatever they term it in Canada. He had a fracture of his leg and surgery to repair. That procedure failed. But the response to the failure was "Oh well, your leg will be a couple of inches shorter now. You can wear a built up shoe." No further surgery was offered, allowed or approved. End of the line for his medical care on this. He was elderly, although I don't know if that mattered. He came to the US to get his leg fixed at his own cost. My wife helped him on his journey to the US - one, because he was her uncle, and two, because she works in orthopedics. She said what was originally done to his leg would not be standard practice in the US. That's neither here nor there - different countries sometimes do things differently. But it was the followup - or complete lack thereof - that was an indictment of the Canadian health care system. I am assuming that Canadian medicine refused to fix his leg because of the cost and his age, but I don't know the reason for sure. But bottom line - his care was refused. And it should not have been.

While mine is only one anecdote, it happened to our family. I know it to be true because the guy stayed with us for much of his trip to the US to get his leg fixed. We were the ones picking him up from the airport, taking him to the US hospital, and having him recover at our home (as well as another family members home part of the time). This is not internet hearsay for me. It is a solid irrefutable example of Canadian universal healthcare vs. US style healthcare. Things do not always go like this in Canada I'm sure, but they can go like this.

 

[Haertig]

It didn't turn up anything and they wasted a lot of time and resources on nothing

You don't understand how most medicine works. Sometimes you suspect something, and then test for that something.

But more often than that, there are A, B, C, and D things that could cause what you're seeing. So you test for all of them. You rule out A, B and C to prove D. Another reason to test for all of them is you could have both A and D. Because you proved D does not disprove A. You'd probably be screaming bloody murder and suing the hospital if they assumed D was the only thing present and ignored the possibility for A to also be there.

When you bang your head and go to the ER with a headache, they don't observe a bruise - cause D - and send you home. They also do a cat scan looking for A (an internal brain bleed). If that cat scan turns up negative - doesn't find anything - that certainly does not mean it was extraneous and a waste of money. if you don't think A is a possibility, why would you have gone to the ER in the first place? There is no leg to stand on when someone goes in for diagnosis and then complains that they were provided ... diagnosis.

Medicine is very often a game of finding out what it is not, in order to deduce what it is.

 

[sonya123]

https://www.worldometers.info/demographics/life-expectancy/

bottom line, US #48.....all that technology doesn't seem to do us any good....

Cuba is # 56 to put things in perspective , they don't even have electricity half the time!

If I had to fix the system I would do this: universal healthcare for basic lifesaving stuff
private extra insurance for non live saving extra stuff people might want
Problem solved

the way it is here now, government pays for the most expensive people ( old people on Medicare and disabled on Medicaid)
Poor people like us now only get it in some States
work places are trying to avoid giving young people full time work now because of stupid obamacare, so they have no insurance
If you are young and have a part time job, you have no insurance at all now
If you have a family and lose your job, you have no insurance
If you are low income you have no insurance, even if you work ( this applies to many farmers for example)
If you have a good job with health insurance and get sick or have an accident they can lay you off and you have nothing

 

[Amish Heart]

Cuba sucks. That's all I have to say about that. Wouldn't want to be them.

 

[sonya123]

Cuba sucks. That's all I have to say about that. Wouldn't want to be them.

yes!! But we are not too far off....

 

[elkhound]

https://www.worldometers.info/demographics/life-expectancy/

bottom line, US #48.....all that technology doesn't seem to do us any good....

Cuba is # 56 to put things in perspective , they don't even have electricity half the time!

If I had to fix the system I would do this: universal healthcare for basic lifesaving stuff
private extra insurance for non live saving extra stuff people might want
Problem solved

the way it is here now, government pays for the most expensive people ( old people on Medicare and disabled on Medicaid)
Poor people like us now only get it in some States
work places are trying to avoid giving young people full time work now because of stupid obamacare, so they have no insurance
If you are young and have a part time job, you have no insurance at all now
If you have a family and lose your job, you have no insurance
If you are low income you have no insurance, even if you work ( this applies to many farmers for example)
If you have a good job with health insurance and get sick or have an accident they can lay you off and you have nothing

put our politicians on same healthcare and retirement as rest of citizen slobs...their view of us....it get fixed real fast.

 

[Amish Heart]

And politicians should pay for their own groceries, go to the store like everyone else. And pay for their own gasoline instead of it being filled up for them, and paying their own heating bills.

 

[Pearl]

And politicians should pay for their own groceries, go to the store like everyone else. And pay for their own gasoline instead of it being filled up for them, and paying their own heating bills.

And they should have had to get the so called vaccines or get out of office!!