Rant for the Day (keep it clean)

[Amish Heart]

And they should have had to get the so called vaccines or get out of office!!

No one should be made to take a shot

 

[Pearl]

No one should be made to take a shot

I think those WHO KNEW how detrimental the shots are and excused themselves from them should have been given the SAME CHOICE as so many Americans!! Take your so called vaccine or leave your job!!

 

[Amish Heart]

Everybody really should of just left their job. If they were preppers, maybe they could have. I'm glad I had retired the year before, or I would have been told the same by our licensing authority.
If you can do for yourself and live out of the system, then you can't be forced to do things just to eat.

 

[Haertig]

Cuba sucks. That's all I have to say about that. Wouldn't want to be them.

yes!! But we are not too far off....

... and we'd be one step closer with universal healthcare.

But like I said earlier, I would tend to agree with some form of universal healthcare - for my kid's sake. But probably not complete universal healthcare totally controlled by the government. For those that want to be more self-reliant and free of dependency on government, universal healthcare would seem very scary. Forget your privacy and autonomy.

 

[ClemKadiddlehopper]

I got blessed by being appointed temporary lead hand on Monday. It means I am the dip stick that coordinates between the main dispatch/bus shop and the drivers in the satellite location.

My stupid cell phone is constantly beeping away in my pocket, now. Can't check the messages because I'm driving. Pull over and find they need a bus swap done, total 4 hr round trip between morning and afternoon runs and early dismissal today so not much time to get it done. Union drivers can't do it because we had a new contract vote today.

Found an outside temp driver who was willing. Sent her off in the designated bus and she comes back with the replacement plus the mechanic driving the original bus because he asked for the wrong bus and had to swap for correct one to take to the main shop.

 

[Mad Dog 1]

Sorry, I did not intend to offend anyone. There are always exceptions to any generalization. I was thinking of the people who spend every dime they make without even considering their retirement. My son is one of these people. My daughter is exactly the opposite.

e.g., I do not mind giving a helping hand to those in need. We donate lots of money through our church for this purpose. But I do not like giving money as free handouts to people who simply have decided not to work and prefer to live off of others when they could work for themselves.

It is people that are similar to this latter group that I was talking about in my post about retirement savings above. The people who buy themselves a Mercedes when heir finances are more along the lines of a used Beetle. The two family household with an 8000 square foot house. People intentionally living above their means. There is nothing wrong with spending your money on luxuries if you can afford them. But ignoring your retirement is not "being able to afford" these things IMHO.

Sorry do not know what i did here ,cannot see where to delete , lucky my finger is not on any launch button

 

[sonya123]

For those that want to be more self-reliant and free of dependency on government, universal healthcare would seem very scary. Forget your privacy and autonomy.

so you are never going to use medicare? It's funny, people say they don't want government healthcare but as soon as anyone suggests cuts to medicare they are hopping up and down crying usually. I seem to remember maybe Bush giving seniors more medicare benefits and nobody complained. ( could have been someone else but I think it was him)
Same with people on medicaid. I don't hear anyone complaining, including us.
Plus there is public utilities. They might not be great, but better than Cuba LOL
If you REALLY wanted a system that does not have government interference at all you would have to let people die if they have no money to pay for emergency care at the hospital. Most people do not want that either

 

[Haertig]

so you are never going to use medicare? It's funny, people say they don't want government healthcare but as soon as anyone suggests cuts to medicare they are hopping up and down crying usually.

That is because the government has been taking money out of our paychecks for our entire working life to pay for Medicare. It is paid for by Social Security taxes which are mandatory withdrawals. We had no choice about the government taking that money.

And now we want some rate of return on our money that was taken. So we use Medicare, since they won't give our money back to us in cash.

 

[sonya123]

That is because the government has been taking money out of our paychecks for our entire working life to pay for Medicare. It is paid for by Social Security taxes which are mandatory withdrawals. We had no choice about the government taking that money.

And now we want some rate of return on our money that was taken. So we use Medicare, since they won't give our money back to us in cash.

standard response there, only most people pay in way less than they get out
think about how many hundreds of thousands of $ just one major surgery cost, or cancer treatments and stuff
even if you invested well, you would most likely not save enough for major medical problems in old age. Do the math
I did it one time, and unless you die early , you get more than you pay in most likely
It's a pyramid scheme worse than social security.
The way universal healthcare is set up in other countries is NOT a pyramid scheme. Everyone pays in, everyone gets out. Hospital administrators are not millionaires either.

People are of course selfish. They want something for nothing but they don't want anyone else to have something for nothing. Most people do not want a fair system, they just want one that benefits them. So, the most fair system to me would be either A: nobody gets anything at all, or B: everyone gets the same thing

Like I said earlier, if they did that, the politicians could no longer play off different groups against other ones and the population might actually look at real issues and vote for who might be a better person to run the country

 

[Amish Heart]

Medicare doesn't take care of it all, you have to pay for a supplement and for a prescription coverage, and money is taken out of your SS benefit to pay for Medicare. I'd say we get less than we put in for sure. At least that's the case in our family.

 

[sonya123]

Medicare doesn't take care of it all, you have to pay for a supplement and for a prescription coverage, and money is taken out of your SS benefit to pay for Medicare. I'd say we get less than we put in for sure. At least that's the case in our family.

we were talking about having to pay into medicare when you are earning income but ok

here is an example: lets say you average $30000 a year ( this is reasonable because of inflation, some make more some less) assume this is income after all the deductions are taken out and this is the amount taxable
30000* 1.45 % = 435 $ a year
assume you work for 40 years , that comes out to $17, 400
this might be enough to go to the hospital with a broken arm

now, you pay $174 a month for part B of the medicare ( as I understand it you need this to pay for doctor visits)
that is 2088 $ a year

2088 * 20 = $41 760 if you live to 85

so you can realistically only pay for maybe one minor short hospital visit, in ALL of your old years

Math is fact, you can't argue that away

 

[elkhound]

this country can do better on health care for sure... put everyone on same thing...politicians to military veterans to citizens...it get fixed real fast....the starting point is wasteful money spent outside our borders...and over priced govt spending.

same retirement plan as well.

the down fall of healthcare started in 70's when govt took away the law saying healthcare was/had to be non-profit....we were off to the races then...filling stockholders and ceo's and politicians pockets.

 

[Haertig]

standard response there, only most people pay in way less than they get out

That sounds like the classic "We know what's best for you" justification.

FWIW, like Amish Heart, our family gets far less out of Medicare than we paid into it.

Math is fact, you can't argue that away

Your math excludes lots of important factors. Like, most people make a lot more than $30k a year, so their contributions to Medicare go way up. Also, most people invest their money and earn lots more money off of that. It multiplies. And you forgot that Medicare withholding is 1.45% for the individual, but there is also an additional 1.45% withholding that the employer has to pay. They don't pay this out of the goodness of their little hearts, they reduce your salary to make up for these things they must pay. It's part of your "compensation package". You neglected to include any of this in your math. So while "math is fact", you have to include all the components if you want it to be relevant and useful fact. It is also well known that people of lower income receive more from the system than they contribute to it. I'm not against that. But you can't take conclusions drawn for lower income folks perspective and blindly apply those to higher income folks.

But even if we assumed your math was accurate, does that mean that someone should be able to "do the math", calculate an advantage, and then force you to do something you don't want to do - because they claim it's to your advantage? Heck, if that were the case, I'd be forced to install new windows, a new roof, updated A/C, better insulation, siding, solar panels, more efficient appliances, and all kinds of stuff to my house. Or so the salesmen tell me. I guess I'd have to buy an EV too.

Anyway, like I said, I may personally be against universal healthcare, but I would vote for it. To help my kids.

 

[Neb]

That sounds like the classic "We know what's best for you" justification.

FWIW, like Amish Heart, our family gets far less out of Medicare than we paid into it.


Your math excludes lots of important factors. Like, most people make a lot more than $30k a year, so their contributions to Medicare go way up. Also, most people invest their money and earn lots more money off of that. It multiplies. And you forgot that Medicare withholding is 1.45% for the individual, but there is also an additional 1.45% withholding that the employer has to pay. They don't pay this out of the goodness of their little hearts, they reduce your salary to make up for these things they must pay. It's part of your "compensation package". You neglected to include any of this in your math. So while "math is fact", you have to include all the components if you want it to be relevant and useful fact. It is also well known that people of lower income receive more from the system than they contribute to it. I'm not against that. But you can't take conclusions drawn for lower income folks perspective and blindly apply those to higher income folks.

But even if we assumed your math was accurate, does that mean that someone should be able to "do the math", calculate an advantage, and then force you to do something you don't want to do - because they claim it's to your advantage? Heck, if that were the case, I'd be forced to install new windows, a new roof, updated A/C, better insulation, siding, solar panels, more efficient appliances, and all kinds of stuff to my house. Or so the salesmen tell me. I guess I'd have to buy an EV too.

Anyway, like I said, I may personally be against universal healthcare, but I would vote for it. To help my kids.

There is another aspect of government supplied medical care and eliminating private healthcare. Doctors would have no choice but to work for the government at government deemed compensation.it would be a move toward mediocrity in medicine.

Ben

 

[elkhound]

non-profit like it was.

 

[sonya123]

Your math excludes lots of important factors. Like, most people make a lot more than $30k a year, so their contributions to Medicare go way up.

I made 26000 a year as an entry level engineer, I made 105000 as a project manager 20 years later
so average would be 65500 but after all the deductions the income that was taxed would have been less of course

but lets just look : 65500 * 1.45 % = 942.50 a year times 20 = 18,850 is what I paid into the system

and most people do not make as much money as engineering project managers....so my 30000 was probably more accurate
even if you double it it's still minor amounts compared to what just ONE hospital visit costs
26 years ago my hospital visit just to have a kid without any complications and I was out the next day cost over $10000
now it is most likely much more
Just looked it up: average cost in the US of just one heart bypass surgery in 2021 was $123,000

Like I said, math doesn't lie

even if you invested it , you would still not end up with enough money to pay for major health problems. But you didn't invest it, so that is just a sidetracking argument that means little because it isn't reality. Reality is MOST people get out more than they pay in.

 

[sonya123]

There is another aspect of government supplied medical care and eliminating private healthcare. Doctors would have no choice but to work for the government at government deemed compensation.it would be a move toward mediocrity in medicine.

Ben

actually the opposite is true. Most doctors in Germany are doctors because that is what they want to do. I went to school with a few people that became doctors and that is exactly what they wanted to do. Here in the US most likely many doctors become doctors for the money. ( and then there are those that are only doctors because of affirmative action, now that is another very scary topic)
Doctors there get into medical school based on merit ONLY , not by how much money they have or what ethnicity they are

But doctors in Europe still make decent money, more than other jobs, just not as much as in the US. But, they don't have hundreds of thousands of $ in student loans either

 

[Pearl]

There are MANY foreign doctors who come to America to work because they can't make good money where they are from!!

 

[sonya123]

There are MANY foreign doctors who come to America to work because they can't make good money where they are from!!

yeah, from Iran, India, Vietnam, etc, not Europe. I generally don't have a problem with doctors from those countries, have had some and no problems. I will not go to a black doctor in the US because I never know if he or she is only a doctor because of affirmative action. My family doctor in Germany when I was growing up was from Iran. I liked him very much ( and his daughter was a friend, she was in my class in school) . The kids pediatrician in Orlando was from South Korea
One of the dentists here is from Vietnam. She seems pretty good too

worst doctor I have seen ( long story ) : young woman from Puerto Rico , not sure how on earth she got to be a doctor

but that has nothing to do with the medical system here

I wonder how much longer they can keep this all going until it collapses under its own weight

btw I have already most likely gotten more out of the system than I paid in. I bet my helicopter flight and 3 day stay at the hospital plus care afterwards cost way more than then $18000 I paid into it. So I am not complaining for me, but for the system my kids will inherit and have to deal with

 

[Amish Heart]

Doctors may bill medicare for a large enough amount, but they only get paid a fraction of that from medicare and have to call it good enough.
I remember handling mom's billing for PT at the nursing home, and when we had a CARE meeting, I asked them why they get $4K a month for PT (and they did so little) and they said to look again, they get a bit less than $2K a month, they just bill high and they get what they get.