Understanding Narcissism and Narcissists

[Weedygarden]

 

[LadyLocust]

I've purposely avoided this thread for a while because it hits so close to home. My X is an extreme narc. Fits almost all of the traits outlined here. He was a hoarder/spend-thrift (bought multiples & never opened), was insulting to me (always!) with jabs - the whole joking thing like stated above, sought authoritative figures - again stated above, would announce his bday so people would buy him gifts, told how much gifts he gave were worth in seek of praise, and on and on. I was blind and had no idea such a condition existed. My daughter is the golden child and my son the forgotten child. When he left, he was furious that I got the children and worked hard enough to keep them in their home. He retaliated by turning the children against me - ABPA (parental alienation). He is vindictive and laughs when something bad happens to others. My daughter has picked up many of these traits, though she's not vindictive, she will not apologize and does not know empathy. My son is a lost soul. He has a kind-heart (my kid) and did not understand why he felt so awful through it all. It is all so ugly and took me a long time to identify and recover from. I pray for my children and "leave the door open" so to speak knowing I cannot change what they believe as truth. Their father is on his 3rd or 4th wife, but they still believe I was having an affair causing the divorce I spent all the money keeping us broke, and who knows what else. Because it is usually the mom who turns the children against the dad, I was disregarded.
At one point when my son was about 8 he asked how much was in his savings. I told him and asked why. He said the company his dad worked for got bought out and so he might not have a job and wouldn't have anywhere to live (since I got the house.) He was living with his gf. but put this on the kids. Another time, X went to the dr. Both kids were upset because dr. thought it was his heart and he might die. (Dr. told him to lose weight and eat veggies which he doesn't like.) Just some examples of the BS & manipulation. I could care less about him, but what he has done to my children is vile.

 

[Swing]

@LadyLocust I would hug /care reaction, but it's not there. I understand the issue to some extent. I was lucky. Two states evaluated my ex and I. I received sole custody and he should never see them alone again in their lifetime. I consider myself lucky for that ruling.

 

[LadyLocust]

@LadyLocust I would hug /care reaction, but it's not there. I understand the issue to some extent. I was lucky. Two states evaluated my ex and I. I received sole custody and he should never see them alone again in their lifetime. I consider myself lucky for that ruling.

I am so very glad/happy for both you and your son (one correct?). And I mean this sincerely - sometimes the typed word reads like sarcasm. I wouldn't wish it on anyone! A single child saved is a whole circle saved from the hurt.

 

[Swing]

I am so very glad/happy for both you and your son (one correct?). And I mean this sincerely - sometimes the typed word reads like sarcasm. I wouldn't wish it on anyone! A single child saved is a whole circle saved from the hurt.

Two little girls. But I was lucky even if broke. I never told the kids all about their Dad, they didn't need to know the whole story.

 

[LadyLocust]

@Amish Heart Your situation is difficult, but to lighten it ever so slightly since you are on to her~ have you ever heard the Joey + Rory song "Granny's got her Daisy Duke's on"? I'm sorry, but it came to mind when reading about your mom wanting short shorts.

 

[Amish Heart]

Ha Ha, I have!
We took her to church last Sunday, but took her to the later service where the younger ones are. (It's Mennonite). She saw a few teen boys in jean shorts, and she said, "See...it's ok to wear shorts here. Even the ladies in the summer". Ha Ha. Over my dead body will I bring her to church in shorts.
When we picked her up, she was wearing jeans and a blouse with a jean jacket. She said those were her best jeans, and she brought a bag with another pair of jeans to change for afterwards at our house. Ha. I couldn't tell the difference between either pair. Mennonite ladies should be wearing a skirt or a dress. She's whacko. She was raised Old Order, and she knows this.

 

[Weedygarden]

I can hear it!

 

[Weedygarden]

@LadyLocust , I am sorry. It can be a very difficult thing to deal with, and the narcs smile and smirk and think they are entitled to mistreat others. Then they wonder why someone wants nothing to do with them.

 

[winds-of-change]

I can hear it!
View attachment 63374

And my favorite. “Are you calling me a liar?” “You keep bringing up the past.” (Because he keeps doing the same thing in the present).
My ex was a narcissist and then I dated another guy who also seemed to blame everything in me. But that second one didn’t last very long.
I now have a wonderful husband who loves me very much.

 

[mamo]

I'm thinking one married into our family and occasionally she's on *steroids*. It appears she's manipulating their young children so they won't want to spend time with their paternal grandparents. One of the initial moves was to literally move nearly 2 hours away from us and 10 minutes from her relatives, even though our son's employment stayed the same since he works mostly from home. There's also a certain ethnic church that her mother is involved in and she seems to have had a lot of control in the past with plans to do so with our grandchildren. Our children had all their grandparents close by, we only had grandmothers (war and illness took our grandfathers before we were born) and never experienced anything like what we believe is happening. We can see around the corner and it's not a pleasant visual. Our son is intelligent, but we think he's just trying to keep the newest women in his life happy and hoping for the best. We were raised from the ground up and so were our children and *dirt* was a real thing that we physically experienced every day and washed off. We have a wardrobe and actual *mud* porch...very noticeable differences. Wondering how that plays into a Narcissistic mind/acts to oust folks like us.

 

[Weedygarden]

“Are you calling me a liar?”

This is one that someone I know uses. But she also changes it up with, "Are you calling XXX a liar?" Because when they put it like that, "How dare you?" What I notice about some narcs is that they get their lines that they use figured out and use them over and over. And then those of us who are not well rehearsed in responses are stuck without a good response.

 

[goshengirl]

True. I have found that a narcissist will apologize with some form of this - "I'm sorry that you feel that way". They can say that they've take responsibility for apologizing, without actually apologizing for their actions. It's a surprisingly effective manipulation and it's something to watch out for...

Yes, I SO get this.
And with my mother it was always, "Well, we'll just agree to disagree" - with things that were never a matter of disagreement, but rather something she did that was wrong. But like you say, it was surprisingly effective manipulation.

 

[Amish Heart]

My mom just says, "Well anyhow...." and goes on like she never did or said anything.

 

[Weedygarden]

My mom just says, "Well anyhow...." and goes on like she never did or said anything.

The best part of you and your mom is that you and your family have her figured out. It took me many years before I understood that it wasn't the alcoholism in my family that was the BIG problem, it was the narcissism. I believe that alcoholism is a symptom and that many narcs are users and abusers of alcohol and other substances.

 

[Weedygarden]

In one of the narcissism groups, this note came up in the history for a woman, so she shared it again. NM=narcissistic mom, mother

"So FB reminded me of a post my husband tagged me in 2 yrs ago. I put this in my husband’s lunch box and as soon as my NM saw the post, she sent me a DM saying that I never packed her lunch with a note like that. That’s when I knew she was a narcissist

"

The comments/responses were hilarious. I laughed until I cried. I love it when people can make comments about something that are so true, yet so funny. “Yeah mom, I’ve also never XXXXX, there’s some things I save for my husband.”

 

[Amish Heart]

That's a good one. NM's are jealous moms. My mom is jealous of my husband. He doesn't care and eggs her on. 'Mom has called me the last two days and has yelled, "Did you just call me?" Doesn't say hello, just yells that. It's funny.
This morning I was out feeding the chickens and missed a call. Mom has a doc appt tomorrow and I'm taking her. But it's tomorrow. She calls me today and says, "I've been waiting. Got my coat on and you're not here". I told her the appt is tomorrow. She says, "You told me for today. Maybe I didn't hear right". I laughed, because her doc appt is for a hearing test because she is driving me nuts. She thought it was a foot doc appt. No, my husband has a foot doc appt tomorrow. Now she wants one.
So prayers for me tomorrow. I pick her up, take her for the hearing test, take her shopping at Walmart (she wants outdoor chair pads just like mine), and then husband should be done with the foot doc and we'll all meet for lunch. I'm guessing Village Inn, because they have pancakes, and she refuses to chew stuff. Even though the dentist (2 weeks ago) says her dentures are perfect. She likes sweets. Nothing else.
So...if she needs hearing aids, which I believe she will, will she get them? She refuses to use a walker because she says she's not old enough. So I have to hold her hand. Geesh. My husband uses a walker. I doubt she'll want hearing aids. They're for old people and not sexy. She's 88.

 

[Weedygarden]

My mom is jealous of my husband. He doesn't care and eggs her on.

Well, what else is a son-in-law for, except to give his mother-in-law a hard time, with a smile on his face the whole time? I saw my uncles do this to my grandmother. She was always such a jealous narcissist of her children's spouses.

 

[Amish Heart]

I didn't realize that was common, that's interesting. Mom is a manhater, and had only daughters, and she's had three very terrible marriages. We went to a new primary care doc last week and she told the nurse she was allergic to men. I was sitting there thinking, no, actually, you eat them up.
So I am surprised she backs down when my husband teases her when she's telling a really untrue story.
Lately, she's been love bombing our grandson and picking on his twin, our granddaughter. No reason at all.

 

[Weedygarden]

I didn't realize that was common, that's interesting. Mom is a manhater, and had only daughters, and she's had three very terrible marriages. We went to a new primary care doc last week and she told the nurse she was allergic to men. I was sitting there thinking, no, actually, you eat them up.
So I am surprised she backs down when my husband teases her when she's telling a really untrue story.
Lately, she's been love bombing our grandson and picking on his twin, our granddaughter. No reason at all.

She may be a man hater, but narc's really prefer men. Look who narcs go after, and who they sweet talk. Consider the history of someone we know.

 

[LadyLocust]

That's a good one. NM's are jealous moms. My mom is jealous of my husband. He doesn't care and eggs her on. 'Mom has called me the last two days and has yelled, "Did you just call me?" Doesn't say hello, just yells that. It's funny.
This morning I was out feeding the chickens and missed a call. Mom has a doc appt tomorrow and I'm taking her. But it's tomorrow. She calls me today and says, "I've been waiting. Got my coat on and you're not here". I told her the appt is tomorrow. She says, "You told me for today. Maybe I didn't hear right". I laughed, because her doc appt is for a hearing test because she is driving me nuts. She thought it was a foot doc appt. No, my husband has a foot doc appt tomorrow. Now she wants one.
So prayers for me tomorrow. I pick her up, take her for the hearing test, take her shopping at Walmart (she wants outdoor chair pads just like mine), and then husband should be done with the foot doc and we'll all meet for lunch. I'm guessing Village Inn, because they have pancakes, and she refuses to chew stuff. Even though the dentist (2 weeks ago) says her dentures are perfect. She likes sweets. Nothing else.
So...if she needs hearing aids, which I believe she will, will she get them? She refuses to use a walker because she says she's not old enough. So I have to hold her hand. Geesh. My husband uses a walker. I doubt she'll want hearing aids. They're for old people and not sexy. She's 88.

Call and ask if the hearing doc. can call them something else - ear phones??? Sometimes it's the name associated with the item. I don't know if that will help you, but it might be worth a shot.
When my dad was in the hosp. and so sick they kept saying surgery - he envisions saw blades cutting him up. We asked that they refer to them as procedures & he did fine - or at least much easier. (He's not narc. just afraid of being cut on.)

 

[Amish Heart]

Aha! Today was so fun (not). Went to get mom and she was in her nightgown pretending to be asleep, but I knew she wasn't because the cheerios and milk were out. She even put the plant in front of the sliding glass door on the inside, and that is the door I have to come in. She does that to be annoying. So I bang on the door and she says I woke her up. Told her to throw some clothes on or she'll miss her appt. So off we go and she asks for what. I tell her for a hearing test, and that makes her mad. She tells the nurse that I just grabbed her and brought her down and she didn't need a hearing test. So...50% loss in high notes, 30% loss in low notes. Doc tells her she needs to get hearing aids. She tells him she doesn't like them, and she gives him that mean, ugly look. So he says, "Ok, or not. Up to you". We go to Walmart and she shops to her hearts content, and that put her in a great mood. She says she is glad she doesn't have a husband at home so he doesnt say, "What on earth did you spend money on now?". I tell her my husband wouldn't say that to me. And that she chose very rotten husbands. All three of them. We meet my husband for lunch. She's in a good mood. She tells him she doesn't need hearing aids, so he spends all of lunch refusing to talk louder to her, so she can say what a million times. I'm glad that was done. She says she had a great day, and we'll have to do it again soon. Oh, and she ordered the exact same thing I did, even though it's something she won't eat with her dentures. So she took one bite and brought the rest home.

 

[Weedygarden]

LOL! She doesn't need hearing aids Huh? What? What did you say? Speak louder.

I knew someone who needed hearing aids and that was what he kept saying. And that I was mumbling. He was a narcissist as well.

 

[Amish Heart]

No hearing aids or a walker for her. She's too sexy for both.
And the I hate men relationship...you're right about wanting to impress them. But she likes to just use them. We crack up when sometimes she says that she doesn't think she'll get married again. As if that's an option ha.

 

[DodgesMamMaw]

I am sure many of us have lived with these type people. Describes my mother to a tee. I am an only child. My dad died suddenly at 50. I could write a book on the awful things that have happened. She remarried. StepDad has been her caregiver for 31 years. He had a massive stroke 2 weeks ago and had to be careflighted to large hospital. He is 83. She is 85 And has Alzheimer’s. She can barely take care of herself. She was set financially for life. However, the casinos took every penny!! I am having to make all the decisions. Of course, no legal documents. Have hired a lawyer to get everything in order. Both are going to have to be on Medicaid in nursing home. It is really sad. Too vain for wheelchair and diapers. But dang it her hair is going to look good. I am a total opposite to this woman. She knows she needs me now so we are going thru a sweet phase. I know some of you are going to say it is the Alzheimer’s. If so she has had it all my life.

 

[Amish Heart]

That is a hard call. My mom has slight dementia. And now confirmed hearing loss. And she's a mean narc. Sometimes when she is messing with me, I have to figure out which one it is.

 

[Weedygarden]

I am sure many of us have lived with these type people. Describes my mother to a tee. I am an only child. My dad died suddenly at 50. I could write a book on the awful things that have happened. She remarried. StepDad has been her caregiver for 31 years. He had a massive stroke 2 weeks ago and had to be careflighted to large hospital. He is 83. She is 85 And has Alzheimer’s. She can barely take care of herself. She was set financially for life. However, the casinos took every penny!! I am having to make all the decisions. Of course, no legal documents. Have hired a lawyer to get everything in order. Both are going to have to be on Medicaid in nursing home. It is really sad. Too vain for wheelchair and diapers. But dang it her hair is going to look good. I am a total opposite to this woman. She knows she needs me now so we are going thru a sweet phase. I know some of you are going to say it is the Alzheimer’s. If so she has had it all my life.

They often have their family members well trained to take up for them. There are many groups for support on Facebook and one of the common things is that more and more are just going no contact. They realize they will never win with a narcissist. No one wins with a narcissist. In your situation, as an only child, it falls to you. No divided family with siblings who hate on each other. Best to you on this.

 

[DodgesMamMaw]

I have gone through periods where staying away from her was the most healthy thing for me.

 

[Weedygarden]

Another post in one of the FB groups about narcissism.

" We were learning about Narcs in my Psychology class, I found it really interesting, but did you know that 6.2% of adults display NPD?? And 75% of these characteristics are found in MEN?? I was surprised, but I guess it's because I'm used to dealing with a Narc mother. I'm also surprised the percentage is so high! I wonder what the statistic is for those who are narcs that are parents, I feel like it would be high because it gives them a way to be controlling..."

I would have thought that women would be more likely to be narcissists, but maybe because it is more common in women that I know than men.

 

[Weedygarden]

I have gone through periods where staying away from her was the most healthy thing for me.

This is what works best for me, space, no contact.